Lois & Clark Forums Forums General Discussion Off Topic A Canadian Coup?

But, Wendy, from what I've read on CBC, there could be two things that could prevent a coalition government from forming:

1. The Governor General not allowing one to form, and calling an election so that the public decides who they want to lead the country.

2. The PM suspending parliament without dissolving it. I tried to check what this actually means, but couldn't come up with anything.

So, Stephen Harper still has an out. I'm not sure how viable it is however.

MLT, you must be confused. The baby you showed us is the next PM. Haven't you heard? Anybody can take up the position now in Canada!

Actually, Grinch, there are two things that could prevent a coalition from forming, but they aren’t the two that you mentioned.

You’re right in that the Governor General could, if the government is defeated, call another election instead of agreeing to a coalition government by the opposition. However, if I recall correctly, on one occasion in the past, the Governor General refused to call another election because it had only been eight months since the previous election. In this case, it has only been... what? Six weeks?

Besides, what would another election accomplish? Isn’t it entirely possible we would find ourselves right back in the same position? Well, except I suppose it would help us decide what to do with another $300 million dollars of taxpayer money. Think of all the temporary jobs that another election would create. Hey, maybe this is the way to keep Canadians working! We could just have election after election.

But given that it has only been six weeks, and that there is no guarantee that another election would change anything, I'd be surprised if the Governor General doesn't agree to let the opposition have a go at making the government work.

The second thing that could happen to prevent a coalition government from forming is that one or more of the opposition parties could change their minds.

The adjourning of parliament doesn’t solve anything - it just delays things. The government could still be defeated in January. So what does Harper do if the opposition still wants to form a coalition in January? Adjourn to February? March? April? May?

(Hey, I’m sort of liking this. We could end up never again having a government in Canada. And as an anarchist, that would be right up my alley. Besides, think of all the money not having a government would save us. )

Also, the Prime Minister can’t just decide to adjourn parliament. He has to ask the Governor General for permission to adjourn parliament and she can say no.

And she might say no. It’s my understanding that she is only supposed to agree to adjourn when parliament has finished its business for the session - not because the ruling party wants to avoid facing parliament. Also, there is the legal question of whether she can agree to an adjournment from her Prime Minister where her Prime Minister has clearly lost the confidence of the house.

Either way, I'd love to be a fly on the wall in whatever hotel the Governor General is staying in at the moment. Now, THAT would be good entertainment. (Bet the Prime Minister is wishing he'd been nicer to Michaelle Jean now, eh )

Personally, I'm still trying to get my head around the idea that the opposition actually seems to be planning to go to go ahead with this. I really thought they were just saber rattling and would back down when Harper recognized that he was the head of a MINORITY government.

Now, my personal opinion is that the way to solve this is to send all of them to bed without their dinners and tell them they don’t get to be on television again until they learn to play nice. Given how much they seem to like to appear on television, that should work.

ML

And I thought our politics are messy across the border.

I just discovered that there appears to be a third option open to the Governor General. I didn't know this option existed. But apparently, the Governor General can just refuse to accept Harper's resignation and require Harper to go back and work with the opposition to come up with an acceptable working government.

Now, that is an intriguing possibility. But given the mood of the opposition, would it be a futile gesture?

Only one thing is for certain, we are all learning a lot about how a Constitutional Monarchy works

I remember learning somewhere that the distance between the chairs for the government and the chairs for the opposition in the House of Commons is two sword lengths. This was done so that, during debates, the two debaters couldn't pull out their swords and stab each other.

After watching the conduct in the House of Commons these past few days, I'm thinking of writing to suggest that they put bullet proof glass between them as well.

Seriously, these guys (from all parties) have gone off the deep end. Now, if only we could find some way to get them all committed... Or jailed. Hey, is there some way we can take advantage of Harper's 'tough on crime' policies to make that happen?

But help is here. The Governor General has returned home [enter Michaelle Jean on white horse]. I'm sure she'll get them all calmed down. After all, she's a woman. Calm. Collected. The voice of reason. I'm sure she'll have these men well in hand in no time. (Or at least, we can always hope

Well, according to what I saw in the paper today, she's saved the day by shutting down Parliament. I guess it gives Harper some breathing room, but then again, the opposition is breathing fire.

Should be quite a lot of fireworks, come New Year's.

PJ

The hilarious - or infuriating, depending on how seriously you're taking this - thing about Harper's jumping-up-and-down-in-fury reaction is that he's accusing the Liberals and NDP of 'doing backroom deals with separatists'. Well, let's see... In 2004, when Paul Martin's Liberal government hit minority standing due to by-election and other losses, Harper wrote to the then Governor-General asking her to deny any request by Martin to dissolve Parliament as he and the other party leaders (NDP and Bloc Québecois) were in 'close communication' and believed that they could form a government. The letter was signed by all three leaders. Rumour has it something very similar happened in 2000 or so, during the Chrétien era.

Then, when Harper came out of the last election as leader of the largest party but without a majority, who did he announce a coalition with on election night, with votes still being counted in Western Canada? The Bloc Québecois; in other words, the separatists.

Someone needs to explain to Harper how parliamentary democracies work: if your party doesn't have a majority, the only way you can govern is by forming alliances with other parties. Since the election, he's given the appearance that he doesn't think he needs to do that - in fact, given the proposals he put forward, on cutting federal funding for political parties, curbing equal pay claims and other controversial measures, as well as failing to produce a stimulus package for the economy, he was practically thumbing his nose at the other parties. Me, I think he deserves all he gets.

On the other hand, the alternative is still Stéphane Dion, the leader so incompetent that he allows himself to be filmed addressing the nation with a book clearly visible behind him entitled Hot Air!


Wendy

Although, Harper did immediately remove those specific proposals Wendy listed in reponse to the opposition parties' objections. However, there the Coaltion did not budge.

The difference between this coalition and the earlier suggestions that Wendy mentioned is that this one is more specific - for example, it guraantees that the Bloc Quebecois will be part of the consultative process shaping legislation for one and a half years.

There is a provincial election on Monday in Quebec - the PQ is in not in power at the moment but it has been in the past. Pauline Marois is the head of the Parrti Quebecois, the separatist (or soverignist or independiste: you chose the label ) party there. The PQ is in not in power at the moment but it has been in the past. She has been quoted saying that as soon as the Coaltion takes power in Ottawa, they will immediately transfer $1B to Quebec.

I'm still teed at both sides in this whole mess - boys playing testerone challenge with my country at a time when we are facing serious economic challeneges.

Harper's proroguing the House of Commons means, in effect that there will be about an extra week that the House will not sit. (they would ordinarily be shutting down for what I've always thought was a very long Xmas recess )

I'm hoping during this period that all paries will scout out the few adults in their groups and listen to them!

Did have to smile at Dion's video though. Have to wonder how it came to be so ineptly done - I wonder if some insider did this to sabotage him? It's like that NDP caucus conference call that the Tories listened in on. According to the NDP spokesperson, a Tory MP "inadvertenly" was included on the list that set up the conference call. Yeah?? Like how could that happen??

You look for comic relief where you can find it these days.

c.

Speaking of comic relief... Anyone watch the Royal Canadian Air Farce last night? Their final show - other than their new years eve special (I'm in mourning about that, by the way

Well, I guess that no matter what happens in January, Dion will never be Prime Minister. He apparently anounced today that he will be stepping down as leader of the Liberal Party as soon as an interim leader can be appointed.

Now... who will that be? Rae? Ignatieff? Or will they appoint someone else until the leadership convention in May?

The other guy (can never remember the name of the third leadership candidate) withdrew from the race today, throwing his support behind Ignatieff. And I've heard lots of talk about the Liberals wanting to appoint someone here and now that will then just be confirmed during the leadership convention. So... the plot thickens. They are even talking about the possibility that the Liberals could have a full membership vote on the issue - via text messaging.

Hey, maybe we should all take out Liberal Party membership just in case! And I see that you can take out membership on line! With the situation in the House of Commons, this could be your only chance to vote on who the next Prime Minister will be

And in the continuing soup opera... Quebec's election is tonight. So I guess we'll get to see if, so far, Harper's continual pounding of the Bloc has resulted in a resurgence of the separtist party. Last poll results I heard about were that the Liberals are still expected to get a majority government. But who knows. Could be interesting.

ML