Lois & Clark Forums Forums General Discussion Off Topic Harry Potter 6: SPOILERS!!!!!

Back on the original topic, here's a reckless thought thrown in about why Dumbledore was so trusting of Snape. Maybe Snape took an Unbreakable Vow with Dumbledore? We don't really know anything about how much freedom people have when they've taken a vow or how the vow determines whether you've broken it, but say he was under a vow to do whatever Dumbledore tells him to do? When he's under two Unbreakable Vows, perhaps by Dumbledore telling Snape to kill him since he was dying anyway, he was able to satisfy both vows.

It's a better reason than the flimsy one about Snape being regretful for putting Voldemort on James's and Lily's trail. Just a guess.

It's a good guess, and one I have heard several other people (me included) suggest.

Certainly I do not believe that Snape's regret was Dumbledore's sole reason fro trusting him. There has to be more to it than that.

I haven't read through the whole thread yet, though I did read some posts, but I wanted to post this befoe I caught up.

Holy Crap, holy Mother of Pearl, good God.

I didn't expect Dumbledore to die (although by the time Dumbledore and Harry were in the cave, I sort of started getting used to the idea that it's probably him). For the whole book I kept thinking it'll be either Snape or Draco - if Draco fails he dies, and Cissy (I quite like that nickname <g>) did say he will probably not succeed anyway and might even die in the process, and of course Snape would die because he broke the Unbreakable Vow.

*Sob* Poor Dumbledore.

The thing I am most angry about, is that while we don't know everything about Snape (explanation to come), Draco is most definitely a Death Eater from what I can see. I never liked him much, obviously, but I never thought he was actually evil. Bah.

A good theory is posted here , and a friend of mine wrote some similar things here:

I think she has made quite a point, and I hope she's right.

By the way, did anyone else cringe when Harry broke up with Ginny? I was about to hit him with a club. First Clark, then Harry. Men. Lunkheads. <g>

Julie

Okay, just finished the book. (Yeah, I'm a slow reader these days... :-P )

Have to agree that I'm liking Harry less and less. I'm glad he's not a perfect Gary Stu, but he's become far too arrogant for my tastes.

Relationships -- it wouldn't have been such a big surprise if any one of those relationships had suddenly popped up. Maybe two. What got to me was that suddenly everyone was in love. The books have always downplayed relationships, leaving them to little more than subtle hints. Now, suddenly, everyone is kissing and dating and worrying about who might be dating their love interest. It's not so much that the relationships were indidivually out of the blue. It's that the entire concept of "relationships" was suddenly bumped up to the foreground.

Snogging -- I know what the word means, but... where the heck did it come from? To me, it's always sounded like it should have a negative/dirty connotation. It just has an ugly sound to it, especially with those Gs in the middle there forcing you to make a gutteral motion with your throat.

The big one -- Dumbledore. When I heard last book that someone major was going to die, I thought it would be him. Harry's coming of age, the plot is getting more tense. Removing his guardian/father figure would really up the tension. Killing Sirius sort of had the same effect, except that Sirius was never that big a part of the books. I didn't feel as much for him as JK seems to think I should.

This time, though... I went through the last couple of chapters simply not believing it. It made it very weird to read about the funeral and such. Thing is... I still don't believe it. Some of my thoughts have already been expressed, but I'm surprised that no one has mentioned this:

(Dumbledore talking to Draco, pages 591-592)

Got that? See what he offered Draco? He was going to fake Draco's death so convincingly that no one, including Voldemort himself, would even think to look for him and he was offering to do the same for Draco's mother, too, using members of the Order.

It was already established that Dumbledore knew what Draco was up to. He knew Draco would make his move. He'd told Harry not to interfere with Draco or Snape. He froze Harry under the cloak, forcing him to do nothing but bear witness. Harry, with the element of surprise, could have done something. Gotten Dumbledore's wand back. Used expellerama on an unprepared Snape. Something.

Oh, and Dumbledore insisted that he had a secret reason to trust Snape. Harry's guess as to why was just that... a guess. Snape is a member of the Order, and he was acting under Dumbledore's orders.

Snape also protected Harry from the Death Eaters, refusing to attack him and stopping the others when they tried.

The entire thing was a fake-out. Snape didn't kill Dumbledore. He, as a member of the Order, used their secret plan to fake someone's death.

I wouldn't be surprised if the plan included the entire scene inside the cave. Dumbledore insisted that Harry give him the potion to drink. All of it. No matter what. It could well be that the potion was actually part of the act. Partly to give Dumbledore a reason to appear weak (note, BTW, that Dumbledore did improve at certain key moments, when it was needed) and partly as part of the death scene itself. The potion could have protected him from Snape's curse in some way, perhaps transporting him away and leaving a decoy "body" behind.

The cave being part of it would make sense, since the Horcrux there was already gone and since Dumbledore had been so insistant that Harry would have to follow orders no matter what.

The only thing I don't like about that theory is that it leaves Harry with some excess guilt, knowing that he was the one who force-fed the potion to Dumbledore. (And I was kind of surprised that that was never mentioned...)

Basically, it's like sending Harry back to the Dursleys. It seems really evil, like it's putting Harry through unnecessary pain, but there's actually a very good but highly secret reason for it. In the case of the Dursleys, it's because Harry is protected as long as he can call their place home. In this case, it's because Dumbledore needs to be able to act freely, with everyone thinking him dead, so that he can help Harry in secret later. A surprise weapon at a crucial moment or something.

That's my take on it, anyway.

Oh... one last thing... Harry and Ginny's break-up. That actually reminded me more of the end of Spider-man. I'm hoping Ginny will make like MJ in the next book and convince Harry that the danger isn't the important thing. Seems like if Dumbledore is right and love is Harry's strength, then pushing the others away would be a bad idea. (BTW, why is he letting Ron and Hermione come if he thinks it's too dangerous to have loved ones about?)

Of course, the other possibility is that Harry will take out Voldemort, put an end to the whole thing, and then it'll be safe for him to go back to Ginny. We'll see.

Oh, wait. Another thought -- if Harry isn't going back to school next year, then there's no reason why there can't be an 8th book. 7 was one for each year at Hogwarts, but there's no reason now why things can't take another two years. The quest for the horcruxes, the fight with Voldemort, the aftermath... as has been pointed out, that's a lot of material. I suppose it could be done in one fast-paced book, where he gets the first horcrux at the beginning, the second 1/4 of the way through, the third 1/2 way through, the fourth 3/4 of the way through (all roughly), then the final showdown with Voldemort and the denouement for the last 1/4 or so.

Paul

Paul, my take on why everybody was suddenly in love is just the fact that they're coming of age. In the first book, the kids were only 11 years old, too young for most kids to be interested in the opposite sex yet. By this book, Harry is almost 17, though he started having "feelings" about Cho back when he was 14. So I don't think it's all that unusual. Now if they were all adults, I'd think pairing everyone up would be just a contrived wrapup to a series.

As for you theory about Dumbledore faking his own death, it's possible, but I think he's really dead just because the magic that places a portrait of previous, dead headmasters in the headmaster's office added a picture of a slumbering Dumbledore. Sure I think that Dumbledore could have faked it, but somehow I don't think so. You could be right, since we're all just guessing at this point.

I re-read Order of the Phoenix just to remind myself of what happened with all the references to book 5 in book 6. It seems that while I think Dumbledore's dead, it's possible that Sirius is not. We never got confirmation about exactly what spell he was hit by. Did Bellatrix actually hit him with an Avada Kedavra? Or was it another spell that stunned him? He fell behind the veil, so we're only guessing he's dead. He could very well be, but it is strange that JK Rowling wouldn't give us a body. I have a suspicion that the arch leading to the veil may make a reappearance in book 7 since it was never really explored in book 5.

I'm not sure if I think Dumbledore is really dead or not. On one hand, I think J.K. Rowling teaches some decent lessons in the book, and it might be a little... anticlimactic if we learn that death isn't really death. Even if it was just because somebody fixed their death. I know very well that when somebody you love dies, you will try everything you possibly can to deny it really happened, desperately wanting to believe that *something* isn't how it appears, that the person will be coming back to you.

On the other hand, I disagree with the portrait of Dumbledore in the headmaster's office as being "proof." They're portraits of "former headmasters." If Dumbledore has faked his death and left the school to fight bad guys or something of the sort, Professor McGonagall is now the headmistress (or maybe they'll elect a new one). Regardless, he's certainly a "former headmaster," now. Did all of the portraits only appear after retired headmasters had died? Or when they actually retired? I'm not certain we know for sure.

Also, there were a lot of suspicious things going on that night. I refuse to believe that Dumbledore didn't have a good reason to trust Snape, one that we still don't know about. And drinking the liquid... we never really found out what it did. Rowling doesn't usually leave loose ends like that. And the showdown between Dumbledore and Snape seemed like there was more going on underneath than we knew. So, I suppose I'm willing to wait for the next book to see.

Well, I just finished the book today, and though I did like it, mostly the last chapters, I found that it was mostly a book in which we are ginve information, plenty, but basically just info, and little action. My sister (who is really a HP fan ) is convinced that this is the best book so far, but I have to disagree...

Anyway, I think it was lynn who mentioned (the first time around, at least) the theorie of Snape and Dumbledore having agreed that Snape would kill D... Well, my sister thinks so too. I guess it could make sense. Snape could, after all, have gotten in a little too deep in his double game and as a way to keep up the pretense, it could make sense. But I honestly don't know. Who's going to believe Snape if he returns to the 'good side'? I don't see how he could convince the members of the Order.

On a different note, I had a technichal sort of question. Are there mistakes in the book? From a grammatical point of view, or in word use... I'm not a native, so some things can sound strange to me, but be perfectly correct. Other than many comas which felt misplaced, I recall reading something like: 'where they had been mere hours previously'. To me, mere hours+previosuly (my reference is Spanish, and Engliish and Spanish differ quite a bit sometimes) seemed a weird construction...

That's all for now; I'm stil in the proccess of fully digesting the book (but the word sad keeps cooming up ). Oh, and Harry's hero behavior bothered me a lot... I was thinking, here comes another Lunkhead!

EDITED: I forgot. If Dumbledore somehow 'resurrects' in the last book, I'll be truly disappointed. He was the object of a deadly curse, his body found (unlike that of sirius)... Though I hardly think it'll be the case. It's time Harry 'flies' without anyone's protection

Edited (a second time ): I've finally read through the whole thread. I asked my sister about this Dumbledore not being dead possibility, and she said JK has assured that he is dead.

Joining the party late – I just finished reading this book (began yesterday afternoon, finished it a couple of hours before). I haven’t read your comments yet – I wanted to write what I had to say on the book before seeing other people’s views that might affect me. But be sure I will proceed with reading all the posts once I post (I've been eager to read your comments for a very long time!)

First of all, this book did not upset me as much as I thought it would. One would expect that, after being REALLY, REALLY mad with Sirius’s death in Book 5, Dumbledore’s death and Snape’s treason would have affected me just as much, if not more. I had been having notions that all these three would happen /me mumbles something indefinite about careless spoiler-givers - and yet the two major incidents in Book 6 didn’t evoke the anger one (not THE major) incident from Book 5 evoked. But maybe it’s just that Sirius was my favourite character.

I enjoyed the book immensely. However, while reading the others had made my heart thump with agony, this one gave me more quiet emotions – agony too, but mostly a very, very strong feeling of curiosity and impatience about what happens next, maybe stronger than with every other book I’ve read. I still don’t know how I managed to go to bed last night, knowing I had only read two thirds of it.

Also, funnily enough, this is the first time a book (or movie, or anything of that nature) gives me RL fear. (And please bear in mind that I used to read Rosemary’s Baby in the middle of the night, after making sure everyone was asleep.) I went to bed at three, after having finished Chapter 20, had a nightmare that woke me up at five, remembered I had no sheet to cover me and left my bed in search of one... My room was dark (I didn’t want to turn the light on and risk waking anyone up) and I didn’t dare open my closet... Then I thought, “It’s just a book, wizards and Voldemort don’t really exist, I’m not in any danger,” but yet didn’t manage to open the closet... First time it happens to me.

So the book did affect me (although in a more mature way), which is what I seek in a good book. So I feel I should congratulate JKR for her talent and thank her for writing such an awesome book. I’m very glad I had the pleasure to read it I hope the series won’t end with Book 7, it would be such a shame... Book 6 already felt too short…

And now, that we have established that I liked the book I’ll move on to commenting particular persons (and pairings):

Dumbledore: I was glad to see him share memories with Harry... he made him feel stronger and more competent, exactly what he needs to fight Voldemort. And about his death... all I can say is, I’ll miss him. I can’t seem to find words to say anything else about it right now.

Snape: I admit that, despite always having my doubts about him, I didn’t think he’d turn so blatantly to the Dark Side. I expected that he’d continue to act behind this veil of mystery, where he made the Unbreakable Vow and I couldn’t make up my mind about whether he meant it or he was just keeping up pretenses. Even up in the Astronomy Tower, I didn’t think he’d actually proceed with killing Dumbledore. I had guessed he was a very powerful wizard and predicted he’d become Defence teacher in this book. But I hoped he would end up with the good guys – I somehow liked him.

Draco: I had not really thought it would happen, but I always believed it would make things very very interesting if he turned to the good side. Of course, he didn’t, but I was happy to see him in doubt about what he must do, reluctant to kill Dumbledore... I liked that Harry kinda pitied him in the end. Although, to be honest, when Myrtle first said about the boy who visited her, I thought it was Malfoy pretending to fish some information from her – didn’t really think he was sincerely desperate.

The Half-Blood Prince: First guess was Voldemort. Second, was Albus Dumbledore. The thought of James Potter came and went rather quickly, before even Harry considered it. Then, confusion came. At some point Snape was added in the mixture, then taken out. Hermione’s suggestion seemed ludicrous. By the time of the revelation, I was almost convinced that it had been Voldemort and was considering the fact that the book might have been a Horcrux.

R.A.B.: One person that might fit here is Sirius’s brother, Regulus Black. He’s dead - Voldemort killed him, or had him killed – and he could have a middle name starting with an A. It also occurs to me that maybe it’s someone who didn’t die, after all, someone we don’t know and we’ll meet in Book 7. Probably male. But I’m so full of thoughts I can’t decide which one I consider most likely.

Harry & Ginny: Shocking! JKR had been very subtle with romance in the previous books, I found it peculiar how Harry had such strong feelings with the first time he saw Ginny and Dean kissing – I would have expected it to be a gradual, slow-moving process. Although it did make for some funny lines:

It wasn’t bad, but, to be honest, I don’t think anyone of the characters we know is *the one* for Harry. But well, who knows… if he goes hunting for the Horcruxes next year, he might meet another girl who will suit him better… me, for example… just kidding. But I really can’t see him marry anyone of the characters already presented. (God, I was so glad the story with Cho was over!) Now, if he lives to get married, that’s a whole other topic.

Ron & Hermione: Argh! It’s been building for books, and they still haven’t hooked up! I so liked a couple of scenes, like the one in the greenhouses, chapter 14. I bet my head they’ll end up together. If they survive, that is, because with JKR you never know… /me mumbles something indefinite involving her favourite, very dead, character, and Harry ‘I have no one to protect me’ Potter.

Tonks & Lupin: Awww! I was of Harry’s mind, I thought Tonks had fallen for Sirius. But it was nice to see them end up together. Lupin has been alone for a very long time (of his three best friends, one died, one was imprisoned and then died, and one faked his own death and then turned to the Dark Side. Poor guy had no one left.) and the age difference doesn’t bother me – Tonks really loves him, and it seems like he has honest feelings for her, too.

Bill & Fleur: I basically want to comment on the ending – very, very good! I never disliked Fleur, but I was glad to see that her head has deflated a bit, because she was very annoying at times. And she genuinely loves Bill, yay, good for him! I’d like to have seen a bit more of Bill’s feelings for her, though.

Harry: Last, but not least – actually, most of all. Again, the Ginny story was a little peculiar – a little forced, I wonder? But the rest was the Harry we know and love, a little insecure, Gryffindorily brave, with a rare intelligence – the kind of intelligence a hero needs. I loved the trick he played on Ron with the Felix, and I went ROFL in the scenes with the house-elves. (Although that was not just because of Harry, to be fair.) So he wouldn’t want to return to Hogwarts? I can only imagine how he’s feeling. And, I’ll miss Hogwarts, but Harry in action would be very fascinating. I hope he kills Voldemort and he makes Bellatrix Lestrange and Snape suffer (although I wouldn’t mind if he killed them, too). But I also hope that he won’t change – going through what he’s been is tough and further suffering might darken his soul beyond repair. (What do you mean, “he’s just a book character”?)

That’s all for now… Off to read everyone’s comments and I might be back with more.

See ya,
AnnaBtG.

I have no theories of my own to contribute (didn't get around to thinking about what might happen next... too busy sulking about having to wait two years for Book 7 ). But the more I read the theory about Snape killing Dumbledore under Dumbledore's orders, with all the points Lynn, Roger, Paul and others have contributed, the more logical it sounds. As many of you have said, Snape's 'regret' for the Potters' death is too flimsy a reason for Dumbledore to trust him. To be honest, I didn't realize it was supposed to be *the* reason until Harry told the others in the hospital wing. There's gotta be something else. And... a non-mysterious-Snape, clearly on the Dark Side? Nah... sounds almost of character. (Although if he really proves to be evil, I want him *tortured*.)

I just remembered... reading Chapter 2, where Snape explains Bellatrix why she should trust him, I had spotted a hole he didn't cover and Bellatrix didn't notice... although I can't remember what it was. I might check it later.

ROTFLOL! You're right, Rivka!

Lynn, I only started reading Harry Potter fanfic a month ago and can't give you many recommendations. But, if you're interested in comedy, I think you shouldn't miss Albus Dumbledore\'s Inbox .

This thought occured to me, too. /me hopes it will occur to JKR, too.

Amen to that, Roger! I always thought that she was going to do something about it in Book 6 and was very disappointed to see no mention of it at all. I had almost stopped hoping... thought it was just the Sirius fan in me... but comments like those keep my hope alive!

See ya,
AnnaBtG.

There is one major hole in the theory that Dumbledore and Snape had pre-arranged Snape's killing of Dumbledore. Surely Dumbledore would know what affect that situation would have on Harry? Surely he would know that as much as Harry already despises Snape, he'd be out for some serious revenge after he saw Snape kill Dumbledore?

So now Harry is running loose looking not only for Voldemort but for Snape as well. Wouldn't Dumbledore want not only for Harry to focus *all* of his energy on finding Voldemort but also to spare Snape the possibility of being killed by a revenge-spewing Harry?

Perhaps Dumbleore has left behind a letter or something to let Harry know that Snape is not really the bad guy so Harry won't go after him.

Lynn

Okay... finished a bit ago and dove straight into this thread. I've kinda pieced together my reply as I was reading the thread so forgive anything incoherent or repeated.

I kind of felt cheated by this book... while a great deal did happen, not much did. Someone earlier said that this all just seemed like a set up for book seven, JKR moving her chess pieces into place. Harry learned a great deal, but he didn't *do* anything. Though I guess seeing Voldemort might get tiring if we see it every time... it's just... I felt like I read this only to get background information and to watch Dumbledore's death, at which I didn't even cry because I was expecting it not to be real somehow.

I have to agree with Karen on the fanfic quality... that going hand in hand with Chris's thoughts about the Ginny/Harry relationship being contrived. As with his relationship/feelings for Cho, I thought it was pretty much out of the blue. Sure, it's normal (I’m guessing) for a teenage boy to have a few different crushes and what not... but when someone with such a tortured life as Harry has little bursts of moments being a teenager (aside from his appalling stubbornness in OotP ), it's jarring for me. Which is why it started reading a bit like fanfic. Dark, tortured hero finds true love and sets out on his quest to defeat the bad guy. I'm sorry... doesn't *quite* work for me with Harry Potter. Didn't hate it, though. I haven't read any HP fic (other than bits of DD's Inbox and Nekkid Quidditch), so I thought Karen had meant fanfic in general as opposed to HP fic, as many people thought.

As for Snape... I still, like others, want to believe that Snape is a good guy at heart. I think it's Dumbledore's insistence that's tripping me up on believing, after everything that's happened, that Snape isn't evil after all. Can't remember who said it, but I like the idea that Dumbledore was pleading for Snape to kill him... hard to believe... but makes a bit of sense in a way. I don't think we've found out the reason for Dumbledore's staunch belief in Snape. My only theory... They made an unbreakable vow. (And I now read someone else thought of that one, too )

I really like this prediction, Lynn (and Emily, too). Let's hope it's true. Then of course there's Paul's *excellent* point about what Dumbledore told Draco. Very interesting. And JKR does like to plant clues...

Everyone's speculations (thanks for that link, Joy!) answered most of my questions, but the one thing still burning in my mind: Why on earth did this book start with the Ministry alliance between wizards and muggles? There has to be a reason.

Chris said, and Roger commented:

Roger has a good point, and what he said made me realize something. Yes, Harry may not be able to defeat Voldemort on his own, but that's why his friends have vowed to stand by and fight with him. Together, they are stronger than alone... Oy... and I say that after my complaint about this being fanfic-y. :rolleyes:

Another thing that irked me was Harry's final stand against Snape. Maybe this has something to do with what someone pointed out earlier - that Harry doesn't deal too well with panic. But why didn't he try the spells non-verbally? Surely that would have worked.

I thought this was explained quite well in OotP, right? I'd have to back and check, but I'm pretty sure Snape or Dumbledore told Harry all this when he asked the same questions.

And I think that does it for my disjointed ramblings.

Sara (who would like to note that she *did* like the book... just felt cheated is all *sigh*)

EDIT: I forgot to mention one thought I had on the Ginny/Harry relationship... While it was unexpected, I didn't mind it so much. In fact, I rather like it considering he's always wanted a family and he's had those stirrings of love and affection for Mrs. Weasley and the rest of the clan. Wouldn't it just be fitting for him to actually become part of the family?

Don't you still have to wave your wand and stuff? There are nonverbal/somatic requirements to spells, otherwise wouldn't they fire off anytime anyone spoke of them? Anyway, he was quite frozen, so I don't find it unbelievable that he couldn't do anything. Though, I would have believed it more if maybe he had at least tried to think a spell at someone.

Aria explained very well why he didn't try it up in the Astronomy Tower. But it seems to me that you are wondering about the scene outside Hagrid's hut, where he's trying to attack Snape. If that's the case, I'd like to point out something to you.

From Book 6, Chapter 28:
So Harry DID try a nonverbal spell, but Snape repelled it.

From Book 6, Chapter 2, Snape talking:
See ya,
AnnaBtG.

Thanks, Anna!! Guess I was reading too quickly as the scene was suspenseful. So thanks for pointing that out.

Sara

/me lets out one big Ohhhhhhhhhhh. I'll buy that explanation for now.

I musta charged right over that. <g>

Thanks, Anna!

JD

You're welcome, girls

See ya,
AnnaBtG. (who just began re-reading Book 6. Okay, so I'm addicted. Sue me )

I'm such a nerd; I've hardly been on these boards and I'm just drawn right to the Harry Potter. :rolleyes:

Here are my thoughts in no particular order. Feel free to disagree or ignore.

Snape: Not evil. Sorry, I'm not convinced. I don't see Dumbledore as the type to beg for his life; I do see him as the type to beg for Snape to follow through with a prearranged plan. Snape had to kill Dumbledore or else die, and while I'm sure Snape (well, Good!Snape) would happily die for Dumbledore, D didn't want it that way.

Dumbledore's death: Very upsetting, but not unexpected, I thought. Harry just doesn't have a lot of luck with father figures, has he?

I also felt Dumbledore's death was something of a symbol for the end of Harry's youth. While Dumbledore was alive, Harry was still a child and he was still a student. Then . . .

Ginny/Harry: No. No no no, no. I don't think I'd have minded it were it not so RANDOM. Harry goes through the first five books being more or less indifferent to Ginny, in the way any teenaged boy is indifferent to his friend's younger sibling. There's an affection, but no more than the one Harry feels for the rest of the Weasleys. And then all of a sudden Harry's all "Angreh beast! In mah belleh!" just out of NOWHERE.

Even so, it could have been redeemed, but JKR insisted on not letting us see them alone. They had long conversations by the lake, okay, but why don't we get to hear them? It's the "show, don't tell" principle, I guess.

Ron/Hermione: I don't mind. I've always seen more on the Ron/Hermy front than the H/Hr front. They're stuck, as Harry's friends, being in the background; they might as well be together.

Won Won/Lavender: The funny thing about this is that you see relationships like this in high school. At least, I do. Hah.

Tonks/Lupin: Oh, that Tonks. Who doesn't love her? Isn't she cool with that amazing power? Isn't she funny? Isn't it adorable how she's all clumsy? Aren't those cute "the Weird Sisters" shirts completely stylish? Weren't you worried when she was upset? Isn't it sweet how she loved Remus in spite of everything? Isn't that wonderful that they're dating now? Surely they'll live happily ever after!

I'm afraid I see Tonks as something of a Mary Sue. A lot of people disagree, and that's fine. She was a little more tolerable in this book, perhaps because she wasn't EVERYWHERE, but . . . I don't know. Reading her feels like reading an OFC in a fanfic. I'll shut up on that now.

Draco Malfoy: I'll admit, I've long since been a Draco fan. I'll spare you the essay (I seriously almost wrote one) but let's just say: "Way in over his head. The poor dear."

Fenrir Greyback: Huh? Metaphor for paedophilia what?

I'll stop now. Thanks for reading. Or not reading. Or whatever.

--Tessa, who doth babble.

Oh, oh, oh! While going on with my re-reading, I found the hole I had spotted in Chapter 2!! I had spotted it the first time around, it had convinced me that Snape is on the good side, and then, reading on, I forgot all about it. (I'll blame it to JKR's talent of twisting everything and making you doubt even who you are.)

I don't think I've seen it mentioned here, so I'll go on with it:

From Book 6, Chapter 2, Snape and Bellatrix discussing about the fight in the Ministry from Book 5:
She does not insist on how come the six teenagers were joined by half of the Order... which means she cannot imagine what we know:

From Book 5, Chapter 37, Dumbledore speaking:
Does Voldemort, or any Death Eater know about this? I don't think so, for two reasons:

a)Had Voldemort found out, I don't think Snape could have come up with a plausible explanation. "I alerted the Order in case Potter spoke to Dumbledore about what he told me"? No, no, no. He could have simply claimed he didn't know who Padfoot was - how could he? They weren't friends or something. Dumbledore, on the other hand... is not suspecting, or assuming. He *knows*.

b) Assume Snape *has* an explanation about all this. Wouldn't he give both the facts and the explanation to Bellatrix? Okay, so he has Voldemort's trust and everything, but he seems so willing to explain his motives to her (probably wanting to finish this once and for all), so why leave this aside? I don't think he could resist seeing the humiliated look in her face

So, the way I see it, when it came down to choosing who to help - Harry or the Death Eaters - he chose Harry.

Feel free to share your opinions on my theory (if you care enough to read it, that is).

See ya,
AnnaBtG.

EDITED TO ADD:

From Book 6, Chapter 2, Snape speaking:
Very conveniently forgetting how this injury was related to destroying one of Voldemort's Horcruxes and how you helped Dumbledore escape death, aren't you, Snapey? I wonder if you at least mentioned it to your Master... (My guess is a big, fat NO.)

Why would Bellatrix be suspicious? There was ample opportunity for one of the six kids to contact the Order of the Phoenix. Snape did not have to be involved with how the Order knew to go to the Ministry. And if asked, Snape could easily say that he didn't know. Maybe the kids contacted Dumbledore?

For some reason, I cannot remember Dumbledore ever saying exactly what happened when he got his hand ruined. We knew it was going after the cracked ring. But I don't recall any details. Did I just miss it?

My point exactly, Roger. Snape kept the information hidden from the Death Eaters; he did not reveal it, twisting it so that it seemed that he was working for them; because he was NOT working for them, he was helping the Order.

True, there are no details. But there is something.

From Book 6, Chapter 23, Dumbledore talking to Harry:
If Snape had wanted Dumbledore dead all along, why proceed with 'timely action' that kept him alive?

Just MHO, of course.

See ya,
AnnaBtG.