Lois & Clark Forums Forums Fan Fiction Fanfic Related Why no Smallville crossovers?

Okay, I’ve been dying to ask this for some time. I understand that there are no regular Smallville fics here, this is about L&C and I’m quite happy with that.

But I expected to see some Smallville crossover. I have my own (long) list of issues with that show but it is out there and part of the larger Superman universe.

For me, after 7 long (and I mean LONG) years, Smallville is at a place that is “interesting” and I have some ideas in mind. However, I’m still confused about the lack of this type of story. In the time I’ve been here I can only remember one story that had the feel of a Smallville crossover and that was Dandello’s Coffee at the Bakery .

To me, the more interesting possibilities would be to drop our Lois or Clark into that universe but I can also see possibilities the other way.

So, what is it? Dislike of Smallville? Lack of Interest? Something else?

Bob

There's this one too:

http://www.lcfanfic.com/stories/2006/groupthe.txt

I found it interesting...

As for Smallville.... I tend to avoid WB shows like the plague... I looked at it after I got back into LnC this past summer and just didn't feel any interest in it after peeking at some season synopses.

It's probably less about Smallville per se then it is that for some reason crossovers generally have never really featured in FoLCdom.

I have no idea why. They've just never been as popular a genre to explore here as they have been in other fandoms.

In recent years, we've seen more of them than previously, but they still must be one of the less featured genres in the fandom.

LabRat

Labby's right, crossover generally don't do well here, which has me concerned with the Stargate/LnC crossover series I am working on.

However, I LOVE crossover stories and so if you write it, I will read it.

James

I think it really depends on the crossover and to me Smallville and LnC just don't mesh very well.

Stargate I can actually see working. There's nothing in LnC that says the Stargate program can't exist and the the SGC could certainly have someone watching Metropolis and her favorite alien. (In fact, I signed up to do that one and never got to it. Maybe over Xmas.)

I'm afraid a Smallville/LnC xover would turn out like my 'Plane Storm' or some variation.

One set gets transported to the other universe, LnC see the other pair as childish and immature, try to fix things, fail (because the SV pair are childish and immature).

I can see this conversation:
Lnc (3rd or 4th season) Lois (Lois 1) to Clark 1 after meeting SV Lois & Clark and watching them a while.

Lois 1 : Please tell me I wasn't that psychotic at her age?

Clark 1: (has the good sense not to answer directly) She IS very driven and really should cut down on the caffeine.

Lois 1: And what's with him? Shouldn't he be traveling or something?

Clark 1: Well, that's what I was doing at his age. Obviously things are different here.

Lois 1: They cannot be that different. I mean he's... You were never...

Clark 1: (shrugs) He's obviously had a much tougher life than I had.

Lois 1: (muttering) Tough my...

Clark 1: (hearing something) I'll be right back.

Lois 1: Clark!

Clark 1: Maybe all he needs is an example?

I think part of the problem with crossovers is the reader not being a viewer of the other show the story tends to make no sense. They have no reference point for the crossover characters or their story lines.

I, for one, do not watch or did not watch Stargate, Buffy, Heroes, Sliders etc. Also if it is a show from a premium cable channel (HBO etc) i don't get them so obviously I don't watch their shows. I limit the number of shows that must be watched every week to 1 - 3 a season. Why? Because I found my life being dictated too much by TV. I also found that after a couple of seasons I got bored with those types of shows. Like Desperate Housewives, when it started it was one of my 1-3 that I watched. After the first 2 seasons I found I just didn't care for the story lines. They just fell out of the range of possibilities for a small neighborhood street and I just felt they were reaching to keep the show going. I no longer watch it.

So I generally don't read crossover stories because the story generally doesn't make sense with my lack of knowledge of the crossover characters.

This can be an issue - but it doesn't explain why FoLCs in particular are so substantially less likely to read or write crossovers than readers/writers in so many other fandoms, where the genre can be quite well catered for.

You'd think that kind of issue would apply to readers and writers all over the net.

It's a question that's puzzled me for years, I have to admit. )


LabRat

In defense of crossovers - a well written crossover gives enough information about both sets of characters for the reader to make sense of them without prior knowledge.

As a writer I can't assume that everyone knows Frasier Crane, so I have to introduce him as though he was an original character. I can't assume anyone here has heard of Commander Straker and SHADO, so they have to be introduced and the background given (or not, if it's not important to the story).

I can safely assume everyone knows who Lois Lane, Clark Kent and Superman are, but I have to give enough particulars so the reader knows which versions I'm using.

But some crossover possibilities work better than others. Star Trek, Next Gen and Voyager don't seem to work well with Superman, but it could just be the writing.

And, for whatever reason, Superman doesn't seem to generate all that many crossovers in general (except for Batman - but then they're in the same universe so that's a natural). I've seen X-men, one Doctor Who, X-files has been done and there's an SR/Stargate over at ff.net that looks promising but hasn't been updated in ages and ages. There's an SR/Dexter that's not bad.

There's a Remington Steele one floating around here. I've done UFO and Frasier.

But Superman is one that just doesn't seem to play well with others. If you remove the Batman xovers, there's not a lot out there.

When Smallville first appeared I was enthusiastic to see a new view on the Superman universe. However, it only took an episode or two before I reached my tolerance limit of “What in the “bleep” are they thinking!” and switched it off. It was only earlier this year, after I became reacquainted with L&C that I got curious about what was going on with Smallville. So with some help from NetFlix I was able to burn through all of Smallville in a few months. My reaction is still mostly “ugh” (and worse) but amid all that there are some interesting ideas.

I believe that any attempt to do a longer cross over story before Smallville season 8 would be unproductive. (I think Dandello captures the problem nicely in the micro-scene above!) However, as of season 8 you have most of the right people in the right places and they are (finally!) starting to look a little more like the characters I know. My feeling is that there are now some opportunities that simply did not exist before.

Anyway, I mostly just wanted to find out if there was a “no Smallville” rule. I do have some ideas way in the back of my mind that are on “slow cook” and if anything that seems worthwhile appears, it may see the light of day. I do believe that for this to work in this forum, you would have to bring the Smallville versions of the characters into our L&C universe. Then all that you would have to do is fill in enough background details so that non-Smallville readers can understand the critical differences in the character(s). I honestly believe that there is potential for something that would be interesting to an L&C fan. As I said, I have some ideas. However, I do believe that they would have to develop into something that in interesting, entertaining and not too confusing to an L&C audience. That part I’m not so sure of yet.

Bob

There is also an outstanding (and ultimately heart-rending) Beauty and the Beast crossover. It's excellent, and the bad guy turns out to be something of a dork after all.

There is a "no Smallville fic" rule on these boards, but as long as people from the Lois and Clark universe are directly involved in the story (not necessarily the central characters) the story can be posted. At least, that's my understanding of the rule (such as it is). If that's incorrect, someone please let both bob and myself know.

Assuming you mean Becky Bain's Timeless , Terry, that has to be my favourite crossover ever.

And a prime exception to the theory that you can't merge two universes without short-changing one of them or confusing readers who aren't fans of one of them.

I hadn't watched B&TB when I read this, but I never felt lost at any point. Becky managed to make me understand the B&TB characters just as easily as LNC.

If you enjoy crossovers, this one is definitely recommended.

It's not so much a 'no Smallville fic' rule as it's a rule that any fanfic posted here should recognise that we're a forum dedicated to LNC fanfic. So no Smallville fic, no Superman Returns fic, no Heroes fic...you get the picture.

Crossovers, though, are very welcome. So long as the LNC content of the story makes up enough of the total to justify the crossover tag, you're fine to post it here. IOW, you won't get away with one paragraph of LNC in a 30 page story about Harry Potter.

Otherwise, you're good to go.

LabRat

I have found very few authors that were able to flesh out the characters well enough on a crossover well enough for me to enjoy the story, so I only read the ones that James' recommends.

With that being said, I think that Smallville and L&C had different target audiences. In general, most WB shows that I've seen seemed to be targeted to those who haven't graduated from college yet. Of course, that doesn't mean someone older can't enjoy it any more than someone younger can still enjoy L&C.


Elisabeth

I have found very few authors that were able to handle most of the requirements to do a good crossover, not just filling out the visiting characters. In too many cases it's: Oh wouldn't it be fun if X met Y? without giving much thought as to what the characters would even talk about, much less what sort of situation would need both of them to be involved.

Oh, but I just got an idea....

Wow! I had no idea that my innocent little question would generate so much energy. I thought that the answer would probably be either:

More likely: No rule against it, but not done due to lack of interesting story potential
Less likely: There was a general agreement long ago to not do those here.

My read of this thread is that the first is basically the answer. I think the ideas and concerns expressed here are valid and reasonable. I would interpret them as follows:

1. If you are going to do any crossover, it has to be fundamentally a Lois and Clark story, not an excuse to write for the other universe. (Smallville in this case.)

2. It needs to be interesting and entertaining to the “local” audience and can not depend on a high degree of familiarity with the other universe.

And for something like Smallville, which might have a high potential for triggering an automatic negative reaction, I would add:

3. For certain crossovers, don’t even go there unless you're sure you can bring your A-game.

So, I’m excited by the possibility. For my part, I know I’m not ready to try to tackle anything like this yet. But I still think there is a potential for something in this idea. I really can’t honestly say that I have anything worth developing at this time, but now I know the rules and they seem quite reasonable.

Bob

Lol... I'm willing to give anything a look... I am not a fan of the Superman movieverse but Plane Storm and After the Storm are two of my favorite fics ~.^

Sounds like a good summary, Bob. Hopefully you'll bring your A game no matter what you write though.


Elisabeth