Lois & Clark Forums Forums Fan Fiction Fanfic Related Kerth Eligible Story List

That's exactly what is done and why it's done this way. Many stories fit many categories, and the categories can all be fairly subjective. The only thing not subjective is the lengths.

I've checked with the archive, none of them has uploaded their stories to the archive yet.

Everything that is uploaded to the archive in one year is automatically eligible for the Kerths, unless otherwise stated. Stories that have been posted in a calender year but haven't made it to the archive yet, can be made eligible by alerting the Kerth committee.

So I'm guessing the three authors you've mentioned, Elisabeth, haven't made their stories eligible (and therefor cannot be considered as BNA). However, they could absolutely be considered for next year.

Saskia

Unfortunately, Carol, we cannot extend the nomination period. If we did that would affect all the set dates. Remember that you don't have to nominate stories in every category. Nominations in only one category are fine.

Tricia

When it comes to the category of BNA we're talking about the *author*, not the story. It's a unique category. All new *authors* for a particular year are entered into the Kerths. Whether their stories are on the Archive or not is irrelevent.

The criteria for eligibility for this award is the posting of the first story or stories by an author anywhere in the fandom. That year, the author is considered a brand new author and is included in the BNA category. They cannot claim to be one two years after posting their first story. It doesn't matter when they consider they first started posting, if they consider that that first story doesn't count because it wasn't their best - what counts is the posting date.


Mercy has been added to the New Authors’ list.

Also Shayne T has requested that Time and Again be made eligible. It has been added to the list.

Thanks,

Tricia.

But Tricia, doesn't a new author have to have at least one story availabe to be considered as a new author? At least, I do judge them by the stories they have available.

And I'm still not convinced Elisabeth isn't eligible this year. The story you refer to isn't on the archive, has never been eligible and nor has she been up as an eligible BNA before...

So I'm horribly confused as how to intepret the rules about who is eligible as BNA. I always went by the rule I already explained above, and now it seems to be different?

Thanks, Tricia, for considering the question.

I know that, but it doesn't feel right to me to nominate stories without having considered the other potentials in that category.

(That doesn't mean I've ever read them all, in the past, but I have given them all a chance - read the vignettes, and the first few pages of the rest, then read the complete story of the remainder, reread a few to compare, etc.)

c.

I think that's what Tricia said in her post, Sas:

As Tricia noted, the criteria for BNA is fairly simple. Each year any author who has posted their first story in the eligible period is automatically put on the list for the BNA award. The eligible story only has to have been posted anywhere in the fandom, as Tricia says - whether it was on the Archive or not is completely irrelevant. It could be posted on the Archive, on the mbs, on an author's personal website...the only important factor is that it is the first piece of work that this author has published in FoLCdom.

Of course, you're right that BNA is awarded - at least partly - on stories. It would be strange if it were not! The award is for the author who has first posted in the award year whom readers believe has written the best stories. That's certainly part and parcel of it. But it's still an award for the author, not the story. It celebrates the best new author of the year. And in that it's unique in the Kerths, because all of the other awards are for the stories alone.

Elisabeth first posted on these mbs in 2005. Therefore, that was the year in which she was eligible for BNA. I understand that it may regrettably be the case that in 2005 her name was omitted from the BNA eligibles list in error. If so, then that is deeply unfortunate and a bit of a sad situation. Hardly ideal. But errors do happen. That's why on the Kerth site, K-Comm ask that anyone noticing an omission informs them so that the error can be rectified. It is going to happen, now and then. K-Comm, just like the rest of we humans ain't infallible. Just like Mercy was omitted by accident this year, K-Comm were informed she should be on the list and now she's been put on the list. Every year, the list changes between it being first posted and the nominations stage as errors are tweaked out of it. Stories are added which were missed, stories are removed which were accidentally added...them's the breaks of such a process.

The onus is, however, on the author to rectify any mistakes, not K-Comm. They cannot be expected to trawl the net tracking down every single story and author eligible for the awards. That's why, with the other awards, if the story wasn't submitted to the Archive in the eligible year (which means it automatically ends up on the eligibles list) the author has to mail K-Comm and let them know they want it included. If they don't, it probably won't be unless some kind FoLC notices for them and alerts K-Comm to the omission.

BNA, as previously noted, is slightly different because the authors on the list come from the eligible stories list. K-Comm, as I understand it, simply goes through the story list, works out which authors posted for the first time that year, and that data forms the BNA list. But it's still possible for them to miss someone out, it's still the responsibility of that author to be paying attention enough to realise the fact and make sure they are on the list in their eligible year and K-Comm still don't have time to go searching them out.

The hard fact is that, if Elisabeth's name was omitted accidentally in 2005, that's regrettable, but it doesn't change the fact that 2005 was the year she was eligible. That 2005 was the only year she was eligible. Not 2006, 2007 or 2008. Authors only have one chance at BNA, unlike the other awards. They can't be considered eligible for BNA a year after they first post or two years - because logically that negates the very purpose of the award. They are, by any way you define it, no longer new after that year they first posted.

So, sadly, if her name was omitted in 2005 when it should have been on the list, then the deadline has long since passed for that error to be made good. Once the nominations came in in 2005, that was it. Game over. The opportunity to correct the error was gone and it can't be made good now.

At least that's my take on it. . But I'm not on K-Comm, so you can take it as being pretty unofficial.

LabRat

I know it doesn't help you out much for this year, Carol, but just for future reference for you and anyone with the same problem - it is possible to get started on reading the majority of the eligible stories without waiting for the eligibles list to be posted by K-Comm.

Each year, fully 90% or more of eligible stories will have been uploaded to the Archive. So if you go here on the Archive website, you can work out without too much difficulty which stories are within the eligible period and start reading right off the bat. Then catch up with the additional stories not on the Archive soon as K-Comm gets the list out.

Although, it's fairly possible that this year was a unique situation and none of this will be necessary next year. I understand there was a delay in getting the list onto the Kerth website due to a technical glitch on the site. Usually, K-Comm get it up pretty smartish, right after I send them the Archive list at the start of January.

But, just in case...it's always an option that might help.

LabRat

ah, I wasn't aware I could retrieve the first half of the year's stories that way. No need for that eligibles list at all then.

c.

edit: think maybe I did know once upon a time, but had forgotten. Have found that eligibles list so handy in previous years that I'd come to rely on it.

Thanks for including Time and Again.

I think it should be easier to nominate stories without seeing all the possibilities than to vote for them. After all, if you nominate a story all you are saying is that it's worthy of consideration. No matter how good the other stories in the category are, if it's worth nominating, then it is.

When you vote, that's when you are trying to compare and contrast, and when you should make sure to read all the nominees.

Or maybe that's just me. I've been known to be lazy at times.

So that means I was "eligible" for BNA the year I posted my first story?

And then, technically, one could be nominated and even voted BNA without having a story up for nomination?

Rat, I understand your point. I've been around long enough to know the rules. I'm only sensing a different interpretation on the BNA issue this year. Yes, you're considered a BNA in the year you post your story. You can only be eligible for that once.

However, over the last years, I always thought you took the BNA out of the eligible story list. Anyone who has their story on their and is a new author, makes it to the BNA category.

Let me put myself up as an example. I wrote and posted my first story in December 2002. By your reasoning, I should've been up for BNA in the 2003 Kerths then. Yet, I wasn't until a year later because that story (and several others) were submitted to the archive in 2003.

So you see, I am now horribly confused as to just what the guideline here is. And if maybe interpretation has shifted? I would at least like to suggest something about BNA being added to the Kerth FAQs.

Saskia

Well, this is an outsider's impression.

I really thought I was clear about BNA, but after reading through this thread, I'm now totally confused.

Here's what I'd always assumed: ( I haven't noticed anything in Kerth practice over the years to contradict what follows. That doesn't mean it's not there, of course. )

-> The Kerths are for completed stories only

- >The 2008 Kerths are for fics completed in 2007. So BNA would be for any new author who completed his/her first L &C fic in 2007. Or who had his first fic posted on the Archive in 2007 *and* had not requested eligibility in any other year.

-> Story eligibility is based on stories posted in the archives, or those submitted to the archive before the December deadline of 2007. No stories posted on the mbs (or elsewhere) are eligible unless the author makes a specific request to K-Com to have them included (and of course herself as a BNA if that's a possibility)

-> if you didn't request to be added to the eligibles list for a new author fic not posted on the archives, but then that fic was posted on the archives during the next year (2008 in this context), then you would be then eligible for BNA in the 2009 K's. (just as there are some stories on the 2008 eligibles list that were posted elsewhere before 2007 - same principle)
..... But, if this author had requested to be included on the eligibles list for the year in which the story was posted elsewhere, then s/he would not be eligible. (the 'one kick at the can' rule. )

-> only the author can make the request to be added to the eligibles list. (otherwise some may be listed who doesn't wish to be by a well-intentioned 3rd party )

what I'm hazy about it this:
Is there a deadline for requesting that you or a fic be added to the eligibles list? Like no requests after noms open? (which would make sense I think)

anyway, has always been my impression. But as I say, I'm now confused.

c.

I guess I'm as confused as Carol here...

So, in theory, I could post a fic to my livejournal or blog or whatever in 2006 but nobody ever heard of it and I wasn't a part of the fandom but I just posted the fic on my own blog - I'd never even heard of Kerths. Since my fic isn't on the archive, it and I are not automatically eligible.

In 2007, I found the fandom and started writing and posting to the boards and archive, but now I'm not eligible for BNA because I knew absolutely nothing about them. If still no one knew about that original fic, then I suppose I might still be included but a bunch of people do so it's well known that my first fic was actually posted to my blog in 2006.

Or even someone who posted a New Years Vignette on Dec. 31 to the boards but who had no knowledge of the Kerths etc. If they did, they may have waited until 1/1 to post but instead are eligible this year instead of next.

I'd never given it too much thought, but I always assumed [yes, yes, I know] that someone was eligible for BNA the first year they had stories eligible. I guess in theory, someone could be posting stories to the boards for years, never put them on the archive and never make them eligible and then one year put them all on the archive making it seem that they were very prolific one year. Right or wrong [and wrong IMO, but...], a new author who has been quite prolific, may have an advantage. Several years ago [and I hope this has changed since then], someone told me that when looking at BNA, several people this particular person knew voted in part based on prolificity [is that right?]. This person also stated that was the only reason I won BNA in 2002. I'd like to think I had SOME talent to back it up [and other noms over the years would bear that out, but still...]. It's unlikely that person even remembers the comment and I haven't seen her on the boards in quite some time, but it's still clear as day to me. Over time, of course, that author's writing has improved so they might have another 'leg up' on other new authors who actually posted their first fic to both the boards and the archive that year. I would think that would be a rare case and those who frequent the boards, at least, would know that as well and possibly take it into account...

I guess I thought that KCom went over the list of fics and anyone who had never had fic eligible before would be on the BNA list and they wouldn't trawl the boards etc. looking for other authors who posted but hadn't put them on the archive.

*shrug* Color me confused and it doesn't apply to me anyway. So if a fic is posted but not finished - a WIP - then the author is eligible the year the fic is finished not started correct?

Thanks.
Carol

Actually, I find myself confused on the BNA issue as well, for the example that Carol just mentioned - that an author's first story/stories could be on a non-L&C site that no one knows anything about. Or perhaps on fanfiction.net - does K-Comm go through the stories posted there to confirm BNA eligible authors? In another fandom I have seen a particular author post several stories, remove them all plus her posting name, then return to the fandom a couple of years later under a new name and several more stories (whether these are the same stories that were posted there earlier, I don't know). It would be hard to keep track of something like that. And of course ff.net is not a dedicated L&C site, but it has a large L&C section that many are well aware of, so it's more prominent than someone's LJ who has remained a lurker on either of the main boards.

Based on what Labby said earlier, Carol, that's what I would believe as well. That is why Mercy is eligible for BNA this year but Estefi isn't.

And Carol, I'm so sorry to hear about that comment made to you about "why" you won BNA. Prolificity (I don't know if it's a real word either, but I really like it so I'm going to use it) may play a factor when some people choose BNA, but wouldn't be the only reason, for anyone. As I recall two or three years ago Michael won BNA and he only had one story. And as your subsequent stories and Kerth noms bear out, your work stands on its own, regardless of how many there are in a given year. Even though I hope you know that it wasn't true, it must have been a hard thing for you to hear, and I'm sorry that the person was bitter/angry/disappointed enough to say it.

Kathy

Kathy - thank you for your kind words. I had 3 individual stories nominated that year and 1 the next [and not much posted after that until this year] so surely there is/was something to back up the nom at least . However, coming after Shayne [have you *read* his stuff?!?!] and before Kaylle [can you say 'In Dreams'?!?!], I still feel extremely undeserving. I did go back and reread the comments from my nominated stories and that was a nice pick me up. Think one may have even sparked a story idea [like I need that right now!], but we'll see...

Carol [off to work on grad class that HAS to be done soon or she'll flunk]

So should I be eligible for BNA? I'm still working on my first gfic (Specimen) but I did write a story as part of the Christmas fication which I'm pretty sure (although haven't checked) I posted at the end of 2007, which I haven't posted to the archives purely out of an odd sense of sentimentality which wants Specimen to be put up there first!

I'm confused

Alisha - you posted 'The Box' on 12/30.

I guess that means you'd be eligible for this year's Kerths [and fits perfectly with my example earlier - you know about Kerths obviously, but had you known it would automatically make you eligible this year, you might have waited - not trying to put 'words in your mouth' or anything, just saying it's a possibility] even though you don't actually have a story eligible.

At least that's the way I understand it from the previous posts, but I could be wrong...
Carol

I must admit that even though for a number of years I have tracked which stories are eligible each year, I haven't kept a list for BNA, but have always just used the eligibility list provided by K-Comm. I understand that K-Comm may have been following this interpretation all along, and that sometimes omissions may be made that are no one's fault. This year we have at least two authors - Mercy and Alisha - who have not sent a story to the Archive, but have posted complete stories on either of the mbs and are therefore eligible for BNA. It's possible that there are still more.

K-Comm goes through a lot of work to run a successful Kerth Awards, and I'm loathe to add their workload. However, would it be possible, for the BNA candidates who do not have any stories on the Archive, to list the names of the stories written by those authors. It would make it a little easier to then find and read all the stories written by that author to date. If an author's name does not appear in the thread title of that particular TOC, it is possible to miss it using the Search feature.

Kathy

All right guys, I just got back from a short holiday. BNA is definitely confusing and we're going to rewrite that part of the FAQ so it looks clearer.

The rule is, an author is eligible for BNA the year they have their first story eligible for the Kerth Awards. So, considering Elisabeth never made her story eligible back in 2005, then her first eligible stories are from 2007 and she's therefore eligible for BNA this year. Knowing this, that also means that Mercy and Alisha aren't eligible this year, since they don't have a story eligible yet. They can compete next year.

Sorry for getting everyone confused.

Anyway, we've added Elisabeth to the list, and since nominations have already started, we've discussed a way to make things fair for her. So we've decided to email everyone who's already sent in their nominations, informing them we messed up with the new authors list and asking them whether they want to reconsider for that particular category.

Apologies again! I guess that proves we're human and not totally computer-controlled, doesn't it?

Kaethel
Kerth Coordinator