Lois & Clark Forums Forums Fan Fiction Fanfic Related UK versus US English: Smackdown 2004

This leads me to wonder whether we also have different definitions of 'gelatin'. Over here, gelatin is powder (made from bones) which comes in little packets. You mix it with water, which produces a spongy goo, and then you add it to things to make them gel (ie to fruit juice to produce a jelly, or to eggs and cream to produce a cold mousse).

Yvonne
(keeping out of the pasta/noodle debate <g>)

We call that 'gelatin', too. Unflavored gelatin, to be exact.

- Vicki

I'm with Paul on the noodle/pasta issue. Noodles are things made out of flour paste; pasta is a subset of noodles, with Italian origins.

Oxford has this as the entry for "noodle": "A thin strip or ring of pasta served in soup, with a sauce, etc." (Though I'm not sure where that leaves shell noodles. )

This may be more of a Midwestern thing, but when someone says noodles, egg noodles are what come to mind first. I grew up eating them with butter or gravy and meatballs. Asian food comes to mind second.

I consider pasta either macaroni or spaghetti-type stuff -- linguini, angel-hair, etc. Pretty much anything Italian as opposed to Asian noodles.

Okay, I can't keep quiet.


No way! That's just a legend. And to prove it I looked for dates (and found many other interesting things).

Marco Polo came back from China in 1292, but there's document dated 1244 written by a doctor from Bergamo (a town near Milan) where he tells one of his patients that in order to get well he doesn't have to eat pasta ( Non debes comedare aliquo frutamine neque de carne, bovina nec de sicca neque de pasta lissa nec de caulis ).

This alone shows you that if in 1244 people were eating pasta in Italy, Marco Polo can't be considered the person who introduced it if he came back from China almost fifty years later.

As for pasta itself, its name comes from ancient greek (paste, I think...but Anna can correct me ) which means "a mix of flour and water". The Romans used this food too, in fact in De re coquinaria libri Apicius gives the recipe for a làgana pie, which is basically what we now call lasagne (and we're talking 200 A.D.).

Some even say Marco Polo introduced spaghetti (if not really pasta), but that's not true either. (sorry, Paul )

In fact spaghetti were probably invented in Sicily in a little town called Trabìa. There are references to a dish that looked like very thin stripes of a dough made of flour and water called itriyya. That's actually an Arabic name (Sicily was ruled by Arabs) and even today some Sicilians call spaghetti vermicelli di Tria.

As for Dictionary.com's definition of noodle (A narrow, ribbonlike strip of dried dough, usually made of flour, eggs, and water.), well, this makes me think of tagliatelle more than anything else. And in fact tagliolini, tagliatelle, fettuccine, etc. are usually made with eggs.

On the other hand, pasta is made only with durum wheat semolina [Triticum durum], whereas "noodles" are made with wheat [Triticum vulgare] and usually eggs.

Okay, that's probably more than you ever wanted to know about pasta. Sorry it got so long.

As for marinara sauce, what Yvonne said.

Elena

In Hebrew, we call noodles itriyot (singular, itriyya).

Julie

I've wondered for a long time how I could pull that off, too! When I decide to take a bath instead of a shower, I always take a book and a drink along. I just keep the hand with the book out of the water, and there's always a towel hanging nearby to dry my other hand. One thing I have learned-- it's probably not a good idea to turn on the jets unless you're going to hold the book way up, or the spray'll get it. :p

I've always called 'em all noodles, too-- pasta and noodles are pretty interchangeable around here, although I too tend to call the Italian noodles "pasta", which leaves us with the other category, Chinese noodles. (Then you've got couscous, your Moroccan... um, noodle? Or pasta? Actually, in order to get my 6 y.o. to eat couscous, we call it "mini noodles." Whatever works, right? :p )

I've never seen an electric kettle, either-- although they're a standard kitchen appliance in most of the England-set books I've ever read. I've seen coffee machines with hot water spigots in (7-11 type) gas stations and cafeterias, but have never seen anything but stovetop teapots in people's houses. Interesting, really, because those same houses all use electric coffee pots-- I guess it's because tea isn't the national drink over here that it is in the UK, huh? That so few people use electric kettles, I mean.

Yeah, it's pretty funny, isn't it, that in the US we use euphemisms for bathrooms, such as "restroom" or "washroom" (a lot of elderly folks use the latter). And yet, we have commercials that discuss diarrhea and tampons and personal lubricants, etc., in an awful lot of detail...

~Toc

Ah, but that doesn't explain why we find electric kettles all over the place here in France. Tea is certainly not a national drink here.

Kaethel

Vicki...oddly enough, the last deodorant commercial I remember had Randy Johnson (a big time baseball pitcher) throwing dodge balls at some poor guys. Guess it was supposed to parallel the strength of the deodorant against...well...odor. :rolleyes:

As for tea, I don't drink it much myself, but I know that my friend's dad (of Arab decent, though I'm not sure if that's why ) *EATS* his tea bag! Blech!

Totally OT, but I *had* to comment

Julie?! Having trouble getting up?!?! No!! /me ducks and runs...

Sara

Well, we use our kettles for a lot more than just making tea. An electric kettle heats up water much faster than heating it on the stove, you see, so we use a kettle whenever we want hot drinking water quickly. For example, I boil the kettle and then pour the contents into a pan on the stove in which I'm going to cook my rice or potatoees. Last week, my hot tap broke in the kitchen, so I was boiling water in the kettle for doing the washing up. If I want to make stock with a stock cube, I boil the water in the kettle. And so on. Kettles are great for impatient people.

Yvonne

Ok folcs... About the pasta/noodle thing... calm down, archaeologist here.

Here's how it goes. You get some grass seeds, hit them with a big stone until they're powder, mix them with something to bind them (egg/water/milk/I don't know I buy mine in a packet), make the mix into shapes, then drop them in a pan of boiling water.

It's not exactly rocket science, or baked alaska. Probably eaten way before 1200-whenever, the world over (Sorry El).

The technical term is independant invention. The idea that two people (or more) can come up with the same idea in different places, even in different times, without coming into contact with each other.

Don't ask me about the lingustics of the pasta/noodle stuff though... I call it pasta unless it says noodles on the packet, in which case I use it in stir-fry.

Helga

/me nods sagely. Yup. I use mine for making cupasoup. Oh, and pot noodles. Yes, I know. I like them, okay? :rolleyes:

LabRat (still finding interesting things to read instead of going to bed like she was supposed to twenty minutes back...)

Well, I didn't go back to the beginning of this thread, but I thought I would throw in some thoughts. I liked the kettles in the Australian/NZ/English/Scottish hotels so much, I bought a Krups for home and have it next to the coffee pot. My Irish descended family always used a kettle on the stove, but the electric kettle is so much faster and doesn't waste heat heating the kitchen.
Purists die, but we use tea bags. And artifcial sweetner.
Spaghetti sauce is composed of tomatoe paste (or sauce) and water and spices. I put ground meat in my sauce (not meatballs), but you don't have to.
All you want to know about pasta can be found here: http://www.ilovepasta.org/shapes.html
Jello is a brand of gelatin that sets up when refrigerated and comes in fruit flavors. There is a gelatin drink to strengthen bones and make joints flexible that comes unflavored and in orange flavor.
Jam or jelly are fruit preserves. They even come sugar-free (yay Smuckers!)
Nowhere in the US can you get clotted cream unless it is at a British festival. Only sweetned whipped cream is available. I had clotted cream in Cornwall and it was heaven.
American bacon is not nearly as good as Canadian or English bacon.
Polenta is a porridge made from corn.

Artemis

Had to chime in on these two.

Hey, I faintly resemble that remark! As a kid I used to put Ketchup on my Cottage Cheese, just to drive my Dad nuts. He also hated strawberry milk. He grew up on a dairy farm and apparently sometimes the cows would have an ulcer in their udder which would cause it to turn pink...

Paul, if I had read your comment about Maple Syrup on Cottage Cheese before going on Atkins, I would have definitely tried it.

The other...
Not as much anymore, but the reason for putting it on the forearm was because up until recently, it was taboo to show the armpit.

James, who must say that he is totally enjoying this thread! I am learning all kinds of interesting triva...

Hmmm... wonder where "cloakroom" came from... anybody know?

Wendy, Kaethel, Yvonne, and Labrat have convinced me that I want an electric kettle, too!! Right now! Or at least, really soon. Fast is good (at least when it pertains to hot water!).


Lab, what's a pot noodle? Is it what we call "dumplings"?

So if Wendy had moved to the US instead of Canada, she'd have to import it? (Wendy, do you like clotted cream? Since I just used you as an example?)

Oh, ick! <insert sickly green, nauseous-looking graemlin here>

~Toc

It's a UK institution and fast food meal, Toc. It's a plastic pot containing 'dehydrated mixture of wide noodles, textured soya pieces, and vegetables, available impregnated with a variety of seasoning powders (Beef and Tomato, Chicken and Sweetcorn) and accompanied by a sachet of sauce (Soy, tomato, curry.' You tear off the foil top, fill with boiling water from the kettle, stir, add the sauce, and, hey presto, a hot meal ready to be eaten.

I actually only love the beef and tomato flavour, I have to say. :p And having just read the above description, I'm wondering why I like even that. I won't tell you what Stuart calls them, but it's pretty gross.

They were first introduced in 1979, IIRC, and have a very bad press. They were satirized on TV comedy shows and were generally given the reputation of only being eaten by very, very sad people who didn't have a life and students who couldn't afford to eat better. A website I found said they were a 'Raman-style snack' if that helps. No idea what Raman is.

The current ad campaign for Pot Noodles actually captitalises on this reputation, showing people being ashamed of the fact that they can't resist eating them.

And in recent years they've expanded the range with things like Pot Snack, Pot Rice and so on.

Dave Lister (of Red Dwarf fame) maintains that Pot Noodles don't qualify as foodstuffs.

LabRat

Oh, I think that's overstating the case. He *would* have eaten the Pot Noodle eventually - he just preferred to eat the dogfood first...

And Ramen noodles are the thin, squiggly, dried Chinese noodles that you revitalise with boiling water for a couple of minutes before tossing them in the stir-fry.

Mere

I wonder if they meant Ramen. Ramen noodles are a package of packed wavy noodles with a packet of seasonings, that comes in a variety of flavors . Boil water, throw the noodles in, boil for 3 minutes, add the packet of seasoning, and it's done. Quick, easy, and the perfect food for college students, since right now I think they're selling 8 packages for 1 dollar.

I ate them a lot as a kid, since they were so easy to make. Now, I love the smell, but the taste isn't so appealing. *blech*

Okay, I've been reading this topic with much interest, but haven't contributed at all because in Singapore, we use a mixture of both UK and US words. UK because it's traditional, but certainly lots of US words have filtered into our speech and writing as we watch more US television productions.

Actually, that's not what Ramen is. Ramen is a Japanese term for a specific type of noodles, the Chinese equivalent being "La Mian". Basically, you start with a wheat dough. At least, I think it's wheat. It could be some other grain. The chef works on the dough, kneads it, thumps on it, pulls it so it stretches (hence the term La Mian "To pull on the dough"), and twists it. After working on the dough for some time, it breakes apart and begins to form numerous noodles about 0.3 cm in diameter. That is La Mian, or using its Japanese term, Ramen. The texture of the noodles is tougher and more chewy than normal noodles, because of all that kneading. Good chefs don't use a machine to crank out their ramen. Unlike pasta, I think, which is cranked out using a machines, isn't it? Correct me if I'm wrong.

Traditional Japanese ramen is served in a rich broth that's made with pork ribs, and the broth is simmered hours and hours, so much so that the soup turns milky white. It takes a lot of work and skill to produce a bowl of good ramen. A good bowl of ramen is a treat fit for kings and queens, or as Alton Brown would say, Good Eats.

There is a brand of instant noodles called "Ramen". I think that's what Karen's refering to. There are tons and tons of brands of instant noodles, and they come in compact packets and are wavy. Instant noodles are extremely unhealthy, but they are very popular because they are so tasty and convenient. There are 2 things you can do if you want to up the health value of those noodles. 1) Boil a saucepan full of water, put the noodles in and let the noodles loosen into a mess of... well.. noodles. Then *pour* the water away. Yep. If you want to use the seasoning, boil a smaller batch of fresh water and use that. Do *not* use the water that noodles were boiling in. This may be an urban myth, but apparently wax is used to keep the noodles in its compact shape. 2) Better still, ditch the seasoning. Just reading the contents of the seasoning should be enough for you to lose all appetite. There are chemicals in there that have been proven to be carcinogenic.

Almost all forms of Chinese noodles that are available in the market come in the dehydrated form. You hydrate it (as you would with pasta) and either use it as stir fry, as Meredith mentions, or serve it in a stock/broth/soup. But no, they are not ramen.

EDIT: This is a response to Wendy's post that's below.... There are 2 types of instant noodles, the type when you end up with noodles in soup, and the type that Wendy's ddescribed below. Both are available in North America, if you know where to look. My gut feeling is that the soupy version is more commonly seen in N.America though.


metwin1

Janet said:

Well, I really don't know how people manage without them! I'm always amazed to see people boiling water in the microwave instead of using a kettle - kettles boil more accurately and you can boil more water at a time.

Amazon.com sells electric kettles - this one is a good make, cordless, with a sealed element.

For those of you not used to electric kettles, here's a few more features to ponder: automatic shut-off once it's boiled (no need to wait and watch), a hinged lid which is easy to open and close with one hand, and the better ones also have built-in water filters.

Hate clotted cream! I do like whipped cream, however. Not the stuff out of cans - yuck! - but fresh cream, whipped.

Oh, as for Ramen noodles (US-style): they do exist in the UK, but they're cooked differently. From talking to Americans, and from reading the instructions on the packs here, it seems that they're supposed to be made with lots of water, so that the result is like soup. In the UK, they're made with just enough water to soften the noodles: all the water is absorbed once they're cooked. And then they're served as a side dish. Interesting differences!


Wendy