We're finally done. At least for now.

Bob

I liked it. Sequel please.

Bob I thought you did a wonderful job and I would love to see you do a sequel!. Laura

Very nice. I'm glad you aren't having the memories come back. I like happy endings but not that nothing bad really happened.

A sequal would be good however.

I got a real kick out of this line. Gee, nobody seems to recognize that Clark and Superman look alike!

Great part!

I love how you had Clark's power come back for real after he had spent a day on the beach in the sun. Also loved his problems and his solutions to the conundrum of shaving. I remember that in the old comic books, they solved this problem by saying that Superman's beard and hair didn't grow. In one story from the sixties, however, when Superman had been exposed to red kryptonite, he grew a terrific head of hair and an incredible beard. The hair and beard proved impossible to get rid of, until Supergirl and Krypto the Superdog zapped it with combined beams of their heat vision. That's where later versions of Superman incarnations got their ideas on how to keep Clark well-groomed!

I was just a little disappointed that Martha and Jonathan returned, because even though I like Martha and Jonathan very much (who doesn't?), I thought their reappearance detracted a little from the story. First, their return was like an afterthought, a P.S., and we weren't told a thing about how they had survived. It was in fact quite unlikely that they would be alive, so their survival was a bit like the infamous deus ex machina.

Also and to me more seriously, their reappearance detracted from what I thought was a wonderful premise of this fic, namely the idea that Clark was almost totally dependent on Lois for his continued well-being, and indeed, for his very identity. It was through Lois he remembered anything at all, and never has she grounded him as much as she did in this fic.

So I loved this story!

Ann

Loved this story. Will post more later.

Bob, I liked the story very much. It was a fun ride watching Clark react and interact with Lois without the 'baggage' of being Superman.

Also, it was fun to see Lois able to relate to the more straight foreward and 'open' Clark. It was mindful of the old comic book story where a magician made Superman 'disappear' which basically caused Clark to forget that he was Superman.

This was set in the old canon, where Clark Kent was actually 'mild-mannered'. The Superman-less Clark was more dynamic and forward. He courted Lois Lane and won her over. It wasn't until they were married that Lois discovered that Clark was actually Superman. He still didn't know. Of course, Lois tracked down the villian who caused the disappearance of Superman and made him 'fix' the situation.

Knowing that Superman would have never married her if he'd known he was Superman, Lois left him note and tried to nobly walk out of his life. Naturally Superman realised that he could no more let Lois walk out of his life than he could stop breathing so him found her and brought her back.

The one quibble I have with the story is, that once Clark knows he was Superman he didn't feel more responsible for all the death and destruction that happened. Intellectually he would know that his injuries, lack of powers, and loss of memory would have precluded his ability to have had any affect on what happened. But Clark/Superman has always been the King of 'if only I had...'. It would have been nice to see Lois (talk?) him out of such nonsense.

I fully expected Martha and Jonathan to reappear somewhere near the end, and their appearance really doesn't affect this story, but will have significant impact on the sequel (which you have no choice but to do). I also expect the sequel to have bring out a real divergence of peoples feelings toward the Man of Steel. Even though it's common knowledge that Luthor was the real cause of all the devastation, there are going to be many who will still blame Superman.

Good story.

Tank (who is sorry for rambling on about the old comic book story, but couldn't help but see the correlations between the two Superman-less Clarks)

Excellent story, Bob. It was a believable (within the L&C universe, of course) plot line and you executed it very well. The exploration of the devastation wrought by the Nightfall fragments was very well done, although you could develop that more in the sequel if you chose to do so. And I liked the way you developed the rebuilt relationship between Clark and Lois.

I really liked how Lois, despite her own losses, didn't turn to Clark for total support when he was emotionally open and vulnerable. She helped to build him back up before she allowed herself to open up and return his love. You showed Lois to be strong, independent, confident, and wise. Good job.

Ann wrote:
Shame on you, Ann! You're wishing for the very thing you would have condemned (and have condemned) had Lois been almost totally dependent on Clark for her continued well-being, and indeed, for her very identity. You've described co-dependence very well, and neither Lois nor Clark should be that dependent on the other. A healthy romantic relationship consists of two people who freely choose to commit to each other, not one who controls the other and on whom the other is totally dependent.

That being said, Bob, you really, really need to let us know where Jonathan and Martha have been for all these weeks. I'm sure you have an excellent explanation and I'm ready to hear it.

Although I understand why you didn't want them in the story. You were using Lois and the other residents of Metropolis (including Lex) to rebuild Clark's sense of self, and you did a good job with it. It makes sense that you wouldn't want Clark's past interfering with the reassembly of his present and his future. But now you have a great opportunity for some real angst. Clark doesn't remember us? wails Martha. Son, don't you know us? pleads Jonathan. That will be very interesting to read. Now Lois will get to help Clark rebuild a part of his past, too, now that the present and the future are taken care of.

Thumbs up, Bob! And think about stuff like this more often.

Well, there's not much to say what hasn't been mention before so I'll just focus on the ending. Awwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww

Their day at the beach was a nice way to get some powers back into Clark Glad to see Martha and Jonathan are back. Can't wait to see the sequel!

Michael

I'm not a huge fan of episode rewrites and revisions, but this one worked pretty well. I'm a bit in agreement with others in feeling that bringing Jonathan and Martha at the end was in a sense a cheat, but it works as a trailer for a sequel if the explanation is good.

Yeah! Their not dead!!!

Looking forward to the sequel.

James

It's amazing how a single thought can morph into an epic, isn't it? I can also appreciate how difficult it can be to knit the scenes you *WANT* to include with the ones you *HAVE* to have for the story to flow.

I've also had the fortune to discover your other substantive L&C works, "Luck and Consequences" and "Ultrawoman", and couldn't help but notice your "Super" intense focus on the L&C relationship. (I tend to a bit of softy there). I was also thrilled to discover an "aggressive verisimilitude" in your work, revealing the science behind the powers and actions of Superman or explaining the deviations from laws of physics.

This one looks like it was a more difficult premise to deal with than your earlier work. While the earlier stuff was arguably primarily relationship puff pieces, this one required more plot and more attention to action. Those aspects of the story couldn't just be mentioned in passing. You rose to the challenge, and any quibbles I may have with the story are easily forgotten and hardly worth mentioning. Well done.

I liked the way this was handled. This Clark has a different sort of baggage.

Canon Clark had spend years not doing things because of his secret and built up enough guilt to last two life times. So even after he because Superman all that old guilt was still sitting there. Picture a see-saw with a concrete block on one side. Hard to achieve balance.

Thus canon Clark always felt guilty and clearly even after accepting that logically he was not at fault the emotion remained.

This Clark doesn't have that guilt, so starts off in a better place. As far as he knows he started helping and didn't stop till he was almost killed.

Without all the back drama he is able to emotionally accept that the blame lies with Lex Luthor.

If we assume that his powers come back but not completely or at full strength than it might be better is Superman does not return.

I'd like to see a sequel set 17 to 18 years in the future, (17+1993=2010) when the next generation of Kents begins to fly but I'd happily accept an epilogue.

Well done part, very well done tale.


Yet another good reason for the sequel or epilogue being set 17 years later.

The first thing I’d like to do is address the M&J’s appearance at the end.

When Beverly read the first draft and discovered that M&J had really died when Nightfall smashed Smallville, she asked me to try to find a way for them to survive. I initially refused for two reasons.

1. As I said earlier, there was no place for them in this story.
2. Even if I could find a way for them to survive they could not appear until the very end. I told Beverly that bringing them in this way would harm the artistic integrity of the piece. There is a certain tragic beauty to Clark having really lost all of his past. By bringing back his parents, I've marginalized that aspect of the overall story. It also adds a "jack in the box" surprise ending.

My point is that I understand that there is a nontrivial price to pay for M&J coming in at the end. When Ann, Marcus and others suggest that this might not have been the best thing to do in this story, I completely understand. Having them appear was a tough decision on my part.

In the end, I decided to have them appear. I finally concluded that aside from being the nice thing to do, their presence offers some worthwhile story potential for a sequel. Since I knew I wasn’t going to address either Lex or Superman’s return in this work, I had conceded that a sequel of some sort was going to happen.

As for what is going to happen, I have no idea. I am more drained than I’ve ever been. I will say that I have been toying with some of the ideas that are mentioned in this thread.

Finally, I’m glad Ann and Marcus felt comfortable to say that this might not have been the best thing to do. If no one would have said anything then I’d have thought that it was such a bad decision that no one wanted to tell me. I really do appreciate all the feedback, not just the positive parts.

Now, to the specific comments:

eminMN:
Hi. Thank you. As for a sequel, as I said there will be one. But I want it to be good and that means that it may be a while.


Laura:
Thanks. Reading through these comments has triggered some ideas for the sequel.


dcarson: I agree. I hope to use the sequel to explore some of the real consequences of the aftermath of Nightfall on the world and the memory loss for Clark. I can feel the potential for some very good - and possibly very serious - stories here.


IolantheAlias:
Yeah. I couldn’t resist the dig at FRD (Facial Recognition Disorder)


Ann:
I remember the comic books where Superman’s hair didn’t grow. I never knew when it changed to heat vision. All I know is that in both LnC and animated Superman, it is heat vision now.

I spoke to your M&J points above. As I said, I see and largely agree with your points. I PROMISE that there is a reasonable explanation for:
1. How they survived.
2. Where they were.
3. Why they didn’t phone ahead.
I felt bad enough popping them in at the end the way I did. I would never have done that unless I had an answer to the three questions above. Even if my muse completely abandons me for the rest of the sequel, there will be a short to explain their appearance.

And as for the Lois and Clark relationship. She really did save him. But he was saving her as well. The way saved him was obvious. But with what we know from what happened in S1, this: would almost certainly have gone this way.

They saved each other and to an extent they are co-dependent. But in my mind the fact that Lois is and will always be first, doesn’t mean that there isn’t room for M&J to help Clark pick up the pieces.


c-mom:
I’m glad you liked it.


Tank:
That comic does sound a lot like my story. I’ve never heard of it before. I assume that something happened at the end that “undid” the marriage since they didn’t get married until much later. I’m sure I would have found that to be more than slightly irritating. I considered including the scene where Clark considers Nightfall. I did sketch it up. The key is that this Clark knows that he barely survived Lex’s murder attempt. In fact, he doesn’t even know how he survived. The Clark that is obsessed with everything being his fault died in the K-gas attack. This Clark is much more rational. (Hmmm… Maybe this should be in the sequel.)

As for what might happen in the sequel, I think you and Terry have been talking to my muse. Many people will blame Superman forever for the Nightfall disaster. Clark will have to be ready to deal with that before Superman can return. And even then, actually handling it will be hard.


Terry:
Thank you so much for the kind words.

As for this: You’ve been talking to my muse!


Michael: I have to ask. Was this for M&J or for the floating? Or what probably happened prior to the floating?


Marcus:
As I said, I think I understand how you feel about M&J appearing at the end. When all was said and done, it was for the benefit of the sequel. I hope I can do something with a sequel that justifies the decision. Thanks for the feedback.


James:
I’m glad you liked the ending. Reading this thread alone has moved the sequel forward.


Mr. Beeto: Ummm… guilty. I love this relationship and have a hard time staying away from it. A-plot is overrated anyway. But seriously, I commented along the way that I think there is more A-plot here than in all my other works put together. Thanks. The last three months or so have been a constant stream of:
WHAT HAVE YOU GOTTEN YOURSELF INTO?!
THIS IS BEYOND YOUR SKILL LEVEL!
WHAT HAVE YOU GOTTEN YOURSELF INTO?!
THIS IS BEYOND YOUR SKILL LEVEL!
WHAT HAVE YOU GOTTEN YOURSELF INTO?!
THIS IS BEYOND YOUR SKILL LEVEL!
It has been a humbling experience.

One last note: By what I have to assume is a funny coincidence, just yesterday I received a suggestion that I head over to the Movieverse and check out your “Family Reunion.” I’m looking forward to reading it.


Framework4:
Your assessment of Clark’s reaction to his part in Nightfall is spot-on.
Now this: and this are VERY interesting ideas.


Thanks everyone.

Bob

Sorry to hijack the thread, Bob, but I was really glad to see Mr. Beeto here. Because "Family Reunion" was one of the best fanfics I've read all year.

Go ahead and read it. You'll like it.

IIRC That tale was published in the late 1960s or early 1970s but took place in the 1940s Earth2 'Verse, where they worked for the Daily Star" and Clark beat out his rival, Perry White, for the position as editor and Lois & Clark stay married.
Earth2 Superman bio

Just a couple more comments on Bob's comments:
Tell me about it. That's got to be a common fanfic writer's lament. I had so many of those moments with "Family Reunion". Speaking of which...
Yeah, that's gotta be a coincidence. You'll want to block out plenty of time. That story is about 275,000 words (or 475 pages when combined in a single word doc, with moderate margins). Somehow, I never get inspired by short stories.

Hey, Beeto:
I meant to respond to this but I missed it: I couldn't help but smile at this. I do have a certain interest in this side of Superman, after all, I have a degree in Physics.

I love that stuff. The original reason I started writing was to present my KE ideas for Superman's powers.

Bob

Lovely finish to a wonderful fic, Bob.

I had always been expecting M&J to return, so I would have been surprised if they didn't.

Thanks for writing this

Corrina.

I agree that M&J will be great to have along in the sequel!

And of course we need a sequel, because there are so many loose ends here - like, what happened to Luthor? (Or did you have him captured or killed, Bob, and I missed it??)

Of course, I, too, think that A-plots are overrated and B-plots underrated, but there is so much potential for a fantastic B-plot in a sequel!

Ann

One last thing (I think):
The verisimilitude also resonates with this engineer. Suspension of disbelief should not be a challenge. Things have to make sense for me. I really love that your stories have thoughtfully explanations of things and characters who actually think things through.

Also: I suspect that a lot of people here feel that way. It may explain why L&C:TNAOS fanfic boards are still so active *13 YEARS* after the end of the series, while Movieverse fics have slowed to barely a trickle a mere 4 years after the last film's release. I love the A-Plot and the Movieverse, but I think the L&C:TNAOS B-Plot (the L&C Relationship) is what keeps people emotionally engaged with the characters and inspires the muses in this fandom.

-Brian

Originally posted by Bobbart:

Absolutely! Not only did he save her life by lessening the impact of Nightfall, but he saved her emotionally, too, by saving her from Luthor and giving her himself!

Ann

Um... no, with 'ending' referring to part 26 in general as the ending of this story

Michael

EvelynC:
Thank you. I love happy endings. And while I was struggling with the “artistic necessity” of how to end this story, I was glad to find a reason to go with the more upbeat finish.

I showed your response to Bev. She laughed and pointed out that good things always happen when I listen to her. But then I’ve known that for 29 years.


Corrina:
I was fairly sure that many readers would have figured out that I might end up with M&J alive. I’m glad I didn’t disappoint you.


Ann:
Lex is still out there. He disappeared into the Metropolis sewers and hasn’t been seen.

As for the sequel, I see almost too much A and B plot potential. Unfortunately, as I said earlier I don’t see any development happening for a while. I need some recovery time.


Brian:
I would rather hand no explanation at all than a really bad explanation. For example, I’ve always hated the “higher molecular density” explanation for Superman’s powers. You could almost explain his invulnerability with something like that, but then he would have to weigh haw many thousands of pounds. Also, how do you reconcile invulnerability with human-feeling soft skin?

Just last night I watched “The Core.” It’s always a movie that pops up on my “worst science in a movie” list. (But to be honest, I enjoy it in spite of the stupidity of the science.)

As for the B-plot factor in the strength and longevity of this fandom, I absolutely agree. In many cases the stories in LnC were as weak as any show but they achieved a chemistry in the relationship that transcended the stories. (At least, that is my opinion.) That’s the magic that has me here and convinced this old number crunching software engineer to try writing relationship-driven fiction.


Michael:
Thanks. Sorry for the confusion.


Again, thank you all for the wonderful comments. It has all been so nice that – even though I can hardly believe it – ideas for the sequel are actually swirling in my mind.

But it will be a while.

Bob

I was afraid you were going to kill them off for real, but hoped thatyou would not. Though exploring the depths of clark's pain and anger when he realized that they were gone would be a task. As someone else said, he is the King of "If only". I don't know what his reaction will be when it really hits him that 100 million people died because he didn't forsee the future.

In my eagerness to believe that M&J were not dead, my thought was that they had left Smallville immediately upon learning that Superman did not make it back. Probably were majorly sidetracked in Kansas City. Knowing those two, they stopped to help despite the fact they desperately wanted to find Clark. Maybe they couldn't get out of or around Kansas City. But I felt that they were helping somewhere because that is just who they are and who they taught their son to be.

Excellent story!

Hi, rkn.

When I first considered a sequel, my first thought was that it would be a relatively simple "Superman Returns" story. However, I quickly realized that part of the challenge would be to see how Clark dealt with those people who were going to blame Superman for the Nightfall disaster. It was only when I was well into SkyFall that I realized that there would be two sides to that problem.

Framing the next story may prove to be a daunting task. I'm afraid that it may be a very serious tale.

Thanks for the note.
Bob

This was splendid! I'm glad that trailer video led me here! lol

Would love to know if there was ever/still will be a sequel that covers those points you discussed in the end.

Great job!

Hi, MrsLuthor.

I had almost forgotten that I had promised a sequel. Well, I dug out my notes yesterday and am going to spend some time this week making another run at the rest of the story. (Or at least getting started on it. )

Having looked at my notes, I now remember why this never got anywhere. I know the story that I want to tell - and I think it's a good story - but I'm not sure I can do it justice. However, I am going to do my best to bring it together.

Thank you for the note.
Wish me luck...
Bob

Def. understand that! Good luck & I'm really looking forward to reading what you come up with! I'm sure you're just being hard on yourself.

YAY!

Andreia

A sequel! Yay!