Lois & Clark Fanfic Message Boards
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Page 1 of 3 1 2 3
#66865 10/19/09 11:57 AM
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 3,145
Likes: 3
T
Pulitzer
OP Offline
Pulitzer
T
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 3,145
Likes: 3
peep peep peep

I'm almost scared to read the posts in here.


Life isn't a support system for writing. It's the other way around.

- Stephen King, from On Writing
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 478
Likes: 2
Beat Reporter
Offline
Beat Reporter
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 478
Likes: 2
whinging


Kathryn
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 37
B
Blogger
Offline
Blogger
B
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 37
Well, I guess there's no utopia in store for this version of L&C's society. I'm glad I waited until the story was completely posted before I read it. It's a very powerful story, but such a horrible tragedy, and I certainly wouldn't want to drag it out. I like at least a little joy mixed in my stories, even if they wind up somewhere tragic in the end.

As it is, I think it needs more of a warning posted before the story, especially if you archive it. If I'd known there was such a WHAM! embedded in this story I might have steered clear (although I would have missed a fine story if I had done so) But well written or not, it's also really excruciating and hopeless, and for that reason readers need to be prepared so that they can be in the right frame of mind.

ETA: I know that a warning isn't required; I just think it ought to have one. This board and the archive aren't typically that dark because the show was more in the vein of a romantic comedy, so this story might catch some readers off guard. That was my only point.

Oh, and I agree with the statement that this dangerous, amoral (soulless?) Lois needs taking down.

Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 941
Features Writer
Offline
Features Writer
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 941
Quote
As it is, I think it needs more of a warning posted before the story, especially if you archive it.
Actually, Betty, warnings are not required on either this site or the Archive. Some authors give warnings at the beginning and/or end; some do not. Terry may choose to write one, and I can understand perfectly that you personally would have really wanted one, but it's not mandatory.

Terry, this was quite incredible. As I was reading this last part, and I saw the right-hand bar moving lower and lower down the page without any magical ending in sight, I suddenly realized that in fact there wasn't going to be one.

What a horribly sad situation. For Clark, who, hampered by his fears about his parents, was unable to think clearly enough and therefore boneheadedly agreed to Lois' request. Still for Clark, who has lost the love of his life yet still sees her alive, breathing, yet just a shell of who she was. For Lois, who doesn't realize how much of the quintessential Lois has been lost, which makes that all the sadder. For her family and friends, who do realize it, and who grieve for that loss every day.

If Lois had died, as in She's, most of her loved ones would have grieved and eventually made at least some measure of peace with her loss. Here, even though her body is alive, "Lois" is really gone, and I could imagine that adjusting to this loss would be even harder.

Very well done. I can be as annoyed as anyone else at the ridiculous plot point that had Clark freezing Lois in the first place, but when the idea sparks such a masterful work as this one, I probably shouldn't complain too much...

Kathy

EDITED TO ADD: Terry, I've been thinking about this some more since I originally posted. Lois had lost her memories of the three days prior to the freezing, but I believe that was all. One wonders what the "new" Lois thought when she remembered the previous couple of years. Even if she felt nothing for any of these people anymore, she would still know that hadn't always been the case. Did she feel any twinge of regret whatsoever - or, if forced to look back at all, was it only with a sense of utter detachment? Fascinating questions to ponder... cool


"Our thoughts form the universe. They always matter." - Babylon 5
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 2,018
F
Kerth
Offline
Kerth
F
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 2,018
Quote
Originally posted by Terry Leatherwood:
I'm almost scared to read the posts in here.
And well you should be. Well looking on the bright side since she no longer works for the Daily Planet it won't be long till Clark brings her down.

So do you plan a sequel?


Framework4
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,194
Likes: 1
Top Banana
Offline
Top Banana
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,194
Likes: 1
Tragedy indeed. And Framework is right. The tragedy only deepens because this Lois is not only heartless, she's also dangerous. Which means someone needs to bring her down. Will Clark feel that to be his responsibility, since he created the monster in the first place?


This *is* my happily ever after.
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 2,823
Pulitzer
Offline
Pulitzer
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 2,823
Wow, these are some good comments and good ideas that I totally missed during the beta.

As ever, the FDK here on the boards is amazing!

Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 2,445
Kerth
Offline
Kerth
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 2,445
Glad you didn't back away to give it a happy ending. Sad for Clark, but necessary for the story.


Marcus L. Rowland
Forgotten Futures, The Scientific Romance Role Playing Game
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 5,797
T
TOC Offline
Nobel Peace Prize Winner
Offline
Nobel Peace Prize Winner
T
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 5,797
Betty said:
Quote
Oh, and I agree with the statement that this dangerous, amoral (soulless?) Lois needs taking down.
Framework said:
Quote
Well looking on the bright side since she no longer works for the Daily Planet it won't be long till Clark brings her down.
HappyGirl said:
Quote
Which means someone needs to bring her down. Will Clark feel that to be his responsibility, since he created the monster in the first place?
Interesting. There are a several requests for Clark to bring Lois down, after he brought on Lois's personality change by freezing her in the first place.

Which makes me wonder what the FoLCs here would think of a story where Lois accidentally changed Clark's personality, turning him into an evil Superman, so that it fell on her to bring Clark down and kill him.

Ann

Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,069
BJ Offline
Top Banana
Offline
Top Banana
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,069
Quote
I'm almost scared to read the posts in here.
And well you should be. This was a well written and tragic story, Terry. I'm both glad and saddened by reading it.
mecry

Ann said:
Quote
Interesting. There are a several requests for Clark to bring Lois down, after he brought on Lois's personality change by freezing her in the first place.
I agree. I know that Clark's distance is a direct result of Lois' biting comments and cruel actions, but it's like he doesn't remember his part in her descent into this twisted and bitchy version of herself.

If nothing else, I would have expected Clark to try to become her conscience using his Superman persona (or unseen from the shadows). It may have been a full-time job and it may not have worked, but seeing as how Clark caused the problem by agreeing to her brilliant (/me rolls eyes) freezing plan, I thought Clark might take more responsibility for the outcome. It seems to me like he gave up a little too easily here.

We never did get to see Lois interacting with Superman after the 'big freeze.' Would she treat Superman with the same amount of disdain as her colleagues? Would she see him only as a story, or would some of the old moony-eyed cheerleader still exist?

I also had a hard time accepting Clark and Perry's reactions to Lois' abusive behaviors. I can accept that Perry couldn't fire Lois, but as her boss, there's a whole lot he could have done to discipline her for her poor behavior. Also, her physical attacks on Clark (the slaps, pushes and kicks), while they didn't really hurt him, were physical attacks. That's assault and it's against the law. There should have been some kind of disciplinary actions either Clark or Perry could have taken to show Lois that there *are* consequences to her actions, even if it's just a written warning for her HR file.

BTW, her relationship with this Lance character didn't make sense to me. Lance indicated that he didn't want his key back, so her pregnancy and subsequent abortion wasn't the result of a one-night stand. Lois obviously had some kind of long-term romantic relationship with this man. So here's my question, if Lois has the rational/emotional capacity for a romantic or intimate relationship with Lance, why couldn't she treat anyone at work with a modicum of civility, warmth or friendship - even if she is ultimately faking it?

Overall, it was an interesting (and probably more realistic) take on the bone-headed idea of freezing Lois to meet Jace Mazik's demands. You get bonus points for originality and creating a truly despicable version of Lois. However, as usually happens when I read a story where the toys stay broken, I have a deep and compelling need to read lots WaFFy stories.

/me runs to the archive to re-read Momentum .

Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 37
B
Blogger
Offline
Blogger
B
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 37
Quote
Interesting. There are a several requests for Clark to bring Lois down, after he brought on Lois's personality change by freezing her in the first place.

Which makes me wonder what the FoLCs here would think of a story where Lois accidentally changed Clark's personality, turning him into an evil Superman, so that it fell on her to bring Clark down and kill him.

Ann
Personally, I would never suggest that Clark kill Lois. I meant that she needed to be exposed and stopped, and possibly imprisoned.

But on reading the latest post I've revised my opinion, a little. Everyone was too compliant with Lois's bad behaviour, and that makes them a little complicit in it too.

In particular, both Clark and Superman should have, all along, shown Lois that there would be consequences for her wrong actions. Clark and Perry shouldn't have put up with abusive or unethical behaviours from her at the Planet. Later, when Lois sold out their position, endangering lives, Superman should have been present to provide support and to defend them, and afterwards to take her to task as he would any wrongdoer. Was he just not paying attention to the operation?

So my conclusion is that, if she does other illegal or unethical things in future, (which this version of Lois most certainly will) he should be there to stop her; he should keep as close an eye on her as he did when he was in love with her, because he feels responsible.

Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 1,384
Top Banana
Offline
Top Banana
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 1,384
Clark got off too easy. I agree with the others who said he needs to take responsiblity. He created this monster, and now he just walks away? Uh, uh. This is his cross to bear - for the length of Lois's life, if need be. He doesn't have to love her. He doesn't even have to like her. But he does have to assume responsiblity for what he did to her. mad

I also agree with those who said that *Lois* got off too easy. They are enabling her, which is *not* helping. Lois needs to be held accountable for her actions, and suffer the consequences, just like anyone else. She needs to be, not killed(!), but definitely taken down.

Ann,

Your challenge reminds me of Mary's "Listen". The details are different, but it still involves Lois assuming responsiblity for a (male) Super-being who is a potential danger both to himself and the world. And one who wasn't always particularly likable, either. frown


"Hold on, my friends, to the Constitution and to the Republic for which it stands. Miracles do not cluster and what has happened once in 6,000 years, may not happen again. Hold on to the Constitution" - Daniel Webster
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 8,947
Likes: 28
Boards Chief Administrator
Nobel Peace Prize Winner
Offline
Boards Chief Administrator
Nobel Peace Prize Winner
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 8,947
Likes: 28
peep I, um, have a lot of questions peep

Quote
It had been three months since Lois had stolen Clark’s story. During that time they’d spoken at length only twice, once on a stakeout on the Newtrich sisters where Lois angrily deflected any and all personal or relationship questions Clark threw her way and once when they’d been forced to pool their resources to prevent a coup at the NIA by the deputy director. There were entire days when they didn’t speak, and once went eleven working days without uttering a single syllable to each other.
Why’s Clark even working with her? Perry certainly wouldn’t force her on him after what she did?

Also, how did the Newtrich-stuff play out? Obviously, Lois didn’t get the powers, btw, can you say near miss? But how did she not end up with the powers? Except for Clark not protecting her?

Quote
“I need to take some of that time this Thursday and Friday! Oh, and Monday, too.”
Without the after, this sounds so innocent.

Quote
“My baby, Lois! You took my baby!”
huh?

Quote
Clark glanced around and saw that everyone in the newsroom was now focused on the drama. Lois lifted her hands and spun away from Lance. “My body, my decision! You have no right – “
Err- what? I have an idea but that can’t be right?

Quote
Lois stepped around the desk to put it between herself and Lance. “You’d better not or I’ll sue you right back! You told me you’d had a vasectomy! You lied!”
No way!

You know, it was around this section that I started to realize that a happy ending wasn’t really in sight. A Lois that sleeps around usually doesn’t end up with Clark. What I don’t get is, why did Lance want her as a girlfriend. I mean, for sex, sure, put a gag or something in her mouth and she’s probably good enough company during the time of his needs. But he actually intended to have a baby with her. Which means he liked her. And that’s totally strange. Or he was a total control-freak psycho who wanted to control her using the baby. And he still didn’t know her.

The story-selling/endangering her source thing. When this happened the last time, she got suspended and everything and she’s surely not that much more important now, is she? Even with everything considered. Wouldn’t the government still want to get rid of her after everything she did? And isn’t the paper’s credibility worth anything to the upper management?

Quote
Lois’ professional and personal ethical standards were long gone. She was seeing – and sometimes sleeping with – at least three powerful, important men in state government, trying to generate stories which would earn her even bigger awards.
I don’t know why, but Lois whoring around still shocked me.

Quote
Clark watched as she waved the second Kerth above her head. It was her last week at the Daily Planet. She’d accepted a position with LNN to be a roving political commentator, a position with more money, far more visibility, less oversight of her activities, less responsibility to be completely accurate in her reporting, and no Perry White or Clark Kent to look over her shoulder and ask her if what she was doing was the right thing.
The witch is dead!

Quote
Clark knew he wasn’t supposed to overhear that exchange, so he kept quiet. But he agreed. The moment he’d frozen Lois to deliver her to Jason Mazik and Nigel St. John, he’d killed something inside her, something that had made her uniquely Lois. Her body and mind were still there. She was still beautiful, still brilliantly skilled, still driven to succeed, still Mad Dog Lane in high heels and business suit. But the part of Lois that Clark had loved was dead, buried deep beneath the frozen glacier of her heart, the part of her that she had sacrificed for his parents.
That bit about her being dead, that was written all across this part and no, this is not a happy thing at all. /Looks around at the pile of rubble that is piled up on top of the broken shelf that was used to smash the action figures./

Two more questions: How did Lois manage to stay alive without Clark looking out for her during the events of Season Three?

One year later is about the time the NKers showed up. Will Clark also leave shortly after the Kerths?

What about Lex? Why didn’t he try to make a move for Lois. And given her new personality, who would end up screwing who? I mean, the way Lois is now, she’d probably snub Luthor because he is penniless. But if he still had resources, she’d probably milk him dry and through his body into Hobbs River. Possibly quite literally.

Quote
Originally posted by BJ:
We never did get to see Lois interacting with Superman after the 'big freeze.' Would she treat Superman with the same amount of disdain as her colleagues? Would she see him only as a story, or would some of the old moony-eyed cheerleader still exist?
In part 2, Terry mentioned her wanting to sue his cape-covered behind off.

Last but not least, this story was grippingly written and well presented. But the situation, well, I’m not a happy camper.

Michael, going back into a corner, whimpering like a beaten puppy


Join us on the #loisclark Discord server! We talk about fanfic, our favorite show, life, and more! (It’s almost like the IRC days of old again!)

I go by Michael on the Archives.
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 1,999
T
Merriwether
Offline
Merriwether
T
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 1,999
Is Clark responsible for Lois' radical change? Only partly. Remember, he was against it at first but Lois talked him into it. And we all know he was never very good at saying no to her.

I too find it somewhat incredulous that Lois has survived so long with out the constant intervention by Big Blue. Now that she is at LNN and not in proximity to Clark and the Planet on a Daily basis, she has no chance of staying healthy for much longer. I have to think that someone who she uses, abuses, steps on, or just ticks off will not be so reluctant to take action against her as Perry and Clark were.

Lois' roughshad antics will either cause her to lose her job, or her well-being before too long.

I can see the epilogue now. Lois Lane has finally ticked off Intergang once too often and is snatched and thrown into the icy cold Hobb's Bay. Superman, still feeling guilty, finds out about it and rescues her, sort of. Lois has suffered from extreme hypothermia and her body is virtually frozen. Using his heat vision, Superman warms Lois' body gradually and by some miracle, saves her life.

But there has been another critical impact on Lois. Her personality has changed again. Now Lois is.............?

Tank (who thinks that a proper haircut for Lois might have moderated her attitude some; after all, a short haired Lois always liked Clark)

Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 3,145
Likes: 3
T
Pulitzer
OP Offline
Pulitzer
T
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 3,145
Likes: 3
I didn't expect balloons and party favors, and I didn't get them. In fact, I anticipated that this story would produce frowns rather than smiles. And while I don't ever set out to make people feel bad, life isn't all strawberries and cream.

Kathyrn84, thanks for reading. The ending was hard for me to write, but the story wanted to go that way. I had little choice.

Betty - no Utopia here, at least not through Lois. And there was a warning in the first post.

Quote
In “She’s,” Lois didn’t survive the freezing process. In this story, she does survive – but at a cost.
While this isn't a WHAM warming, it is a danger flag, and since none of the major characters died, I didn't think the warning was necessary.

As far as this Lois being "taken down," someone else should present that tale.

Kathy - thanks for the comments. My understanding of this real but extremely rare phenomena is that memory of events and people is not hindered, but those feelings associated with the events and people is detached from them.

Quote
He hesitated, then leaned closer. “Lois, you used to like it when I brought you coffee in the morning.”

She turned a granite face towards him. “I used to eat chocolate-covered cereal with lots of sugar on it for breakfast, too.”

He straightened. “Meaning what?”

“Meaning I grew up and acquired different tastes. Maybe you need to grow up, too.”
Lois remembers, but she doesn't attach any feelings to those memories.

Framework4 - no sequel in the works, at least not at the moment. That is, of course, subject to change.

Happygirl - you raise a good question. But Lois is behaving selfishly and amorally, not criminally. If anyone "takes her down" it will have to be on some non-criminal level. And even if Clark is partially responsible for her current condition (which he is), it doesn't necessarily follow that he's responsible for cleaning up after her.

IolantheAlias - You're right, the feedback is amazing. I'm never disappointed by the insights people bring to stories, especially mine.

Marcus - Thanks for the comment. The ending fits, even though I wish it didn't.

Ann - You might try Tank's story about Lois taking down a Superman who was everything Jason Trask thought he was in
Lois Lane - Assassin. That might meet your criteria for Lois taking down an evil Superman.

BJ - Chapter 2 contains this statement.
Quote
She stopped speaking to Superman except to get news material, and her attitude towards him was always filled with barely repressed contempt.
Hard to be someone's conscience when that person loathes you.

In this imaginary universe (which is similar to ours but not identical), Clark just decided not to press charges against her. As indicated in the end of the last chapter, he was hoping that she'd eventually heal, and he didn't want any further barriers between them (arrest, trial, possible fine, restraining order, etc.). And while Lois had a long-term relationship with Lance, he read more into it than she did. He wanted something permanent with her. All she wanted from him was sex.

There are lots of WaFFs available on the archive. They're excellent stories, too.

Vicki - I'm a little different from most of the rest of the writers here in that I don't always show everything. Some things are best left to the imagination. And since this was told from Clark's POV, I tried to focus on his emotional suffering.

Michael - wow. Didn't mean to make you whimper, dude. Really.

How did Lois stay alive during S3? Maybe Superman saved her "off-camera" a few times.

The New Kryptonians? Wow, I never even considered that aspect. Certainly Clark would have less emotional attachment to Metropolis, but would he leave his adopted home world? I don't know. Why don't you write it and let us know? Sounds like a great story waiting to be told.

Tank - thanks for reading and commenting. Someone else agreed in another story's feedback (sarcastically, I think) that Lois' attitude problems towards Clark were caused by her overly long hair. Wait - didn't you write that one?

Remember, just because I didn't write Superman saving this mean and nasty Lois doesn't mean it didn't happen. It just means that I didn't write it. And I agree that her meteoric rise will probably be accompanied by an equally meteoric collapse. The epilogue you propose is intriguing, too. Hmmm.

Thanks to all who read, and thanks to all who read and commented!


Life isn't a support system for writing. It's the other way around.

- Stephen King, from On Writing
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 37
B
Blogger
Offline
Blogger
B
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 37
Quote
Betty - no Utopia here, at least not through Lois. And there was a warning in the first post.

quote: In “She’s,” Lois didn’t survive the freezing process. In this story, she does survive – but at a cost.

While this isn't a WHAM warming, it is a danger flag, and since none of the major characters died, I didn't think the warning was necessary.
Well, this community isn't particularly strict about warnings, so perhaps that was adequate for most. I did read it, however, and interpreted it to mean possible brain injury, a difficult recovery, something like that.

As far as I am concerned, what you did with this story was essentially destroy the character of Lois, and the experience of watching this process was worse than a death would have been -- so I still think it was not enough, and would have appreciated a WHAM! warning as well.

This was also the first story of yours that I'd ever read, and I was unprepared for the kind of writer you are. But 'nuff said; I'm sorry for even raising the point.

Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,194
Likes: 1
Top Banana
Offline
Top Banana
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,194
Likes: 1
Betty,

This story was certainly a tragedy. Given that it was the first story of Terry's that you've read, I just want to encourage you to try some of his others on the archive or these boards. They're not all nearly this dark. There's usually a bit of grit involved, but often a very happy ending. So if you just don't like WHAMMY stories, don't write Terry off. He can write WAFFY, too, although he claims it's not his strong suit. Play Me Some Mountain Music would be a nice balancing sample, for example.

And if you need a WAFF fest to get the taste out of your mouth, I suggest an archive author search for Kaethel. Practically guaranteed smoochies every time. wink


This *is* my happily ever after.
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 2,823
Pulitzer
Offline
Pulitzer
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 2,823
This was a tough story to read - and yet a good one. Kudos to Terry. There are a lot of comedies and romances and happy-endings on this site - with good reason. The show was a romantic comedy, and certainly we all love a happy ending.

But life isn't all peaches and cream, and not everything works out OK all the time. In anyone's life. This is a tragic story, pure and simple. When I beta'd it, I was all, "Oohh nooo!" And yet I had to give credit to Terry for telling the story as it should be told. Hard to read - and yet cathartic. Sad, but well done. Honest and true.

Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,483
Top Banana
Offline
Top Banana
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,483
Sometimes its just nice to see a worse case scenario - even one that doesn't involve a full court WHAM.

I can even see how the Newtrich situation could have played out without Clark getting zapped at all - Superman is no longer hanging around Lois Lane so the Newtrich girls have a harder time tracking him down and he's just not making himself a target. I can also see Zara getting into his confidence so when he has to make his choice about watching over Lois or helping his own people, his choice is far easier for him.

And even though Lois came out of the freezing with deficits, there would still be therapies available to help her learn how to compensate for those issues - therapies she never took advantage of and that Perry and Clark were not in a position to force. Clark may be feeling guilty as hell, but even a saint gets tired of trying to help someone who refuses to take responsibility for their own behavior.


Big Apricot Superman Movieverse
The World of Lois & Clark
Richard White to Lois Lane: Lois, Superman is afraid of you. What chance has Clark Kent got? - After the Storm
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 68
Freelance Reporter
Offline
Freelance Reporter
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 68
I Liked this story. I can see Clark Falling for someone else eventually. Maybe when Perry hires Lois' replacement. I've never been a big fan of the whole soulmates thing anyway. I also can see how not having Lois as a consideration will make it easier in the NK arc


"We've been sitting here all night and the longest conversation you've had with a woman was when your mom called."
Leonard to Howard: The Big Bang Theory
Page 1 of 3 1 2 3

Moderated by  Kaylle, SuperBek 

Link Copied to Clipboard
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5