Lois & Clark Forums Forums General Discussion Off Topic Stargate-SG1 Moebius Part 2 (Spoilers)

What an incredible end to the season.

The continuing nod to the Simpsons was well appreciated by this fan, and did not send me down the spiral of "Is this really MY SG1 team, or another one?"

And the fanfic possibilities. What if Sam/Jack/Teal'c had not been killed during the rebellion - what if the future trio had encountered the past trio?

And the pure genius that DANIEL is leading this rebellion that frees earth from the Goauld, enabling humans to advance to the point technologically where they become instrumental in the destruction of most of the system lords. It's terrific.

Early Daniel to me is like "The Willow" (Buffy's sidekick). Brilliant - but mocked for his wild theories about the pyramids - and then, he becomes this powerful warrior in his on right. Like Willow, he transcends cute and helpless and becomes the most powerful member of the team.

Willow with her immense control of magic - and Daniel with having been a higher being - having had access to the secrets of the universe - he out-gunned them all.

I love the comparison between geeky-daniel and past-daniel, and how he's able to brush off the horror of how his counterpart died - he has to be that way - all those years of fighting the goauld, losing Share, the ascensions, they have given him a very thick skin which it's difficult to penetrate. No wild expressions on his face - just a calm, seemingly serene demeanor. Death? Been there. Done it. Several times.

And he's the leader of the rebellion. His interactions with Sam/Teal'c/Jack in altered-timeline was so different from geek-daniel's interactions with them.

It was really well done.

And of course, the alternate sam/jack stuff - pretty funny and sweet. I did like the ending too - still left with the feeling that S&J have finally made it. 8 years of saving the world, sacrificing their own personal desire to be together in order to conform to Airforce regs, since they know that they are really key to keeping earth safe. And now - well, things have changed. And now - it's really Ok for them to make other changes in order to be together.

Can they do it though? Expectation and having are two entirely different things. "Working" with someone and being involved in a loving relationship are also so different. This isn't lois and clark reporting the stories - these are two warriors frequently facing death and horror together. Can they transcend that? Can they transcend the chain of command that has always been in place.

Can Jack be anything but "Sir" to Carter?

I hope so. Because it seems to me, that if they can't make it work, they are doomed. who else could live up to Carter? Who could live up to Jack (Maybe Daniel or Teal'c, but that's not likely to ever happen).

Anyway - I just wanted to say, Bravo to the people who made this happen. great storytelling.

I'm still going *gibber*gibber*gibber*THUD* when thinking about the episode last night. Once again, it kept me laughing. During one point (the first attraction conversation), I stuck a foam apple that I have on my desk into my mouth, or .. no clue what I would have done. But let me tell you, that foam apple is not meant to be eaten. Blech.

Oh, where to start. I never noticed until last night just how pronounced Teal'c's gold makeup was. Either they were more heavy-handed than before, or I just didn't pay much attention. Poor alt-Daniel and Kawalsky. Poor poor Kawalsky just isn't meant to live, is he. *sniff*

I absolutely loved both attraction conversations.. though, really, the 2nd one wasn't really much of a conversation than OMG, they're about to tear each others clothes off! I also liked the interactions between "our" Daniel and the alt-SG1... the banter between him and Jack were still there. We know the fate of the original team, but I'm wondering about the fate of the 2nd team. Did they live out their lives in Ancient Egypt? Did they marry and have kids? How much did they change things...

I'm still trying to get the whole timeline straight in my head. I can only think they were going with divergant timelines, because in order for SG1 to leave the video that was shown at the end, they'd still have to back in the past and do the mission, causing a whole loop. But since they had the video and ZPM, they said they didn't have to do the mission they would have done in 2 weeks time, which means they wouldn't go back in the past to leave the ZPM there... and oy, I'm getting a headache. Again. (chants to self "it's just fiction, it's just fiction")

Another thing that I liked last night? The preview for Season 9. omgomgomgomgomgomgomgomgomgBEN!!!!omgomgomgomgomgomgomgINDRESSBLUES!omgomgomgomgomg*THUD*

Okay. Gonna go back to gibbering in my corner.

I'm with Janeway on trying to figure out time paradoxes...I rapidly lose the will to live. I do wonder about the alternates too though. But not too hard or I get a migraine too. I just like to think they lived happily ever after and leave it at that. <g>

LOL at you and your foam apple, Karen. During the "You're hot"/"I'm attracted to Daniel" scene I just about broke a rib laughing. It was just perfect, wasn't it. Jack's reaction to the Daniel thing was simply priceless - echoing, I'm sure, what a million J/S shippers were saying on the other side of the screen. And his whole, "thought Daniel was gay" thing - a nice little prod to the slashers.

Loved the smoochies of course. So cute and clever of the writers to give us that - almost our Jack and Sam, but not quite. Enough of ours that it was a very satisfying moment after all these years. And the 'sparks flying' - literally - when he kissed her back were very cute. Jack's expression just before he kisses her, cracks me up every time I watch it.

And I loved the whole revisionist history theme. The little nods to previous events - like Jack making sure Daniel has the address home before they go. And his reaction to the stun grenade. Daniel's bewildered, "What's with the [hand gestures]?". Alt Sam wondering if her future self has a boyfriend... <g>

And I loved the little details - like when Kolwalsky's in the near miss with the zat gun and everyone starts running for it and firing back - Alt Sam just stands there, looking around her. Pure civilian, no military instincts at all.

And talking of zat blasts - I just love the scene of them running through the woods, with all those orange flares exploding through the trees around them. Beautifully visual.

All in all, every time I watch these two, by the time the screen fades and the end credits roll I find myself sighing happily and contentedly, with a grin on my face.

What more can you want?

LabRat

Whoever told me I'd love part 2 (LabRat?) was absolutely right. I've seen most of it three times now I just love Amanda's acting all the way through... she walks different, talks different, looks different... which was awesome enough last week, in her frumpy librarian clothes, but this week she's managing to wear Col. Carter's clothes without looking the least bit like Col. Carter.

One question -- the "gateship" thing -- I have a vague memory that at the beginning of Atlantis when they found the ships, there was an argument over what to call them. Did McCay go for "gateship" there, too? Obviously, if so, he got overruled, but it's a funny tie in.

I *adore* the attention to detail in this show -- they got the original actor for Apophis back. And it just seems to be Daniel's fate to be hit by that hand device; it's a wonder he hasn't got brain cancer by now. I guess all the trips through the sarcophagus mitigated the damage

And Ben Browder is looking seriously yummy. I'm still nervous about how the character will come in, but the writers on this show generally do a really good job, so I guess I'll just have to trust them...

PJ

LOL! Yes, this was a tie-in with Stargate: Atlantis. McKay, upon their first use of a puddle jumper, called it Gateship-1 just as the Major and their "SG-1" were about to go through the gate. And just like in Moebius, got exactly the same reaction. Only this time, he didn't get overridden. In Atlantis, they're called Jumper-1 and -2, etc. The words McKay used to explain himself, "It's a ship and it goes through the gate..." are virtually identical.

Like Karen, I'm confused as heck about the timelines. By having the timeship AND the ZPM, they have no need to go into the past. But by not going, that changes time to the point where they shouldn't have the ZPM anymore. Huh? But they still do and it means they now have TWO time machine-equipped puddle jumpers (the one they still have and the one buried at Giza 5,000 years ago). That means we're now dealing with a third timeline installed as the main timeline now since in our original timeline, Jack, Sam, and Teal'c are dead while Daniel likely never returns to the present. Meanwhile the alternate Jack, Sam, and Teal'c live happily ever after in the past, I'm guessing, much to the joy of those J/S shippers.

Another bit of confusion is that if the timeline was changed so that SG-1 didn't exist in the future, then how is it that when alt-Jack, alt-Sam, and alt-Teal'c went back, our SG-1 did actually exist. They shouldn't have because in the altered timeline, SG-1 didn't go back to mess up time in the first place. Daniel shouldn't have been there to meet them. Anyone actually understand what I just wrote?

One complaint I have is exactly the same complaint I had with Back to the Future, Part III. Like in BttF 3, there should be two time machines in the past. In BttF 3, they completely forgot about the DeLorean buried by Doc that Marty finds in the future. They could have avoided the whole fuel problem by just siphoning a couple of pints of gas from the buried DeLorean for the one Marty brought back. In Moebius, they never even thought about the one Daniel and the original SG-1 came in.

Whoa! That means since two SG-1's went into the past, if the alt-SG-1 didn't return to the future, then they could potentially dig up TWO time machine jumpers to add to the one they already have. So the new current timeline will have THREE time machines.

What happened to Daniel's glasses? How can he see if he left them behind on the puddle jumper? Granted, this is more of a Moebius I question.

I agree AT did a wonderful job. Her facial expressions of wonderment and confusion, her frumpy walk, and her very unmilitary reactions made her seem so un-Carter-like. Nice job!

LOL! You're only wondering about Daniel's ever-changing eyesight now? <g> That's more of a 'since season two' question. He does seem to do quite nicely without them. Actually, now that you've mentioned it, since fans have wondered about that for an awful long time now, I'm wondering whether all that stuff in the cell with Alt Daniel being blind as a bat without his wasn't another injoke/nod to the fans.

You pretty much lost me after the first sentence on the timelines <g>, but re the first ship - I assumed that it was confiscated by Apophis's Jaffa and was probably being stored somewhere pretty well-guarded.

I caught a link to the S9 ad yesterday. At the moment, I'm caught between half-excitement and half-trepidation on S9, but I'm really keen to see where they take us. Like you, Pam, they've always come up trumps more often than not in the past when I've been dubious about something, so I'll trust them to get it right once again. The spoilers I've read do look cool.

LabRat

I thought the Gau'uld (first time I've ever had to spell that) took Daniel's glasses when they threw them all in gaol (seems to be more appropriate than "jail") and confiscated everything. Being very nearsighted all my life, I totally appreciated the "Daniel view of the world". However, what I would have said was "Somebody wave so I can find you all." I can still see motion even if I can't see faces clearly. When I read on tvtome that Daniel was getting a simbiot I said "Oh, no!". So I'm glad Teal'c killed alt-Daniel.
We've decided we have to resee the whole two parts again to figure out just what did happen. All I know now is that there are fish in Jack's pond!.

Artemis

I thought Roger's question related to our Daniel, not Alternate Daniel - could have picked him up wrongly though. Roger? <g> But, yes, Alternate Daniel's glasses were taken when they were in Apophis's prison. I can't remember when our Daniel stopped wearing his. Can recall he had them on at Catherine's funeral, but after that I'm coming up blank...

Dang. Guess this means I'll have to go watch part one again to satisfy my curiosity.

That's just reminded me of a scene in part one that I completely forgot about, but which cracks me up. Jack and the rocks. And how great to see Balinsky again. Now if only Dave Dixon would show up at some point... Ah, well. Maybe in S9.

LabRat (big Dave Dixon and SG13 fan...)

Our Daniel has an on-again/off-again relationship with his glasses. I remember him putting eye drops in during.. Summit/Last Stand (the one with the meeting of the system lords, and Daniel acting as Yu's lotar). So I'm guessing that most of the time, Daniel wears contacts now. I can't remember the our-Daniel-glasses situation in Moebius, though. I did love alt-Daniel's vision, because that's how mine looks when I have mine off. The squinting is *way* too familiar, though I've learned to distinguish shapes and faces without them on, since I'm constantly taking mine off throughout the day. I guess alt-Daniel hadn't quite learned that trick.

And Labrat, you hit the nail on the head with the timeline confusion. I would think they'd blow up the timeships.. the second one is kind of useless, since the power ran out, but we don't know what happened to the first one.

This is true and the kids and I were trying to remember how much he's even worn glasses since he came back from his first ascension. Has he worn them or not? (The old memory is like a sieve sometimes. )

(Warning the rest of this may have spoilers for an earlier episode this season so read at your own risk.)

You know, as much I enjoyed this season finale, and I did, I still have to say that my absolute favorite episode this season my have been the "fan" one about the guy who found the stone. Or whatever that was. I laughed so much at that one I thought I was going to split something. Especially when they found out Jack had been having "visions" all along and thought nothing of it.

I could almost see Lois saying/doing something like that . . . :p

Yeah, I think that was called "Citizen Joe" and it was hilarious. I was giggling like crazy and it was a great tribute to the fans. My favorite moment might have been when Joe's son showed him the promo for "Wormhole X-Treme" and he immediately recognized it -- "They stole my idea!" Or the moment he realized Daniel was alive again. That was good, too. This show is so great with humor.

We don't normally tape episodes, but after seeing this one once, we put in a tape to catch the second airing. Definitely worth seeing several times.

PJ

I went back and checked last night. Our Daniel was wearing his glasses on the puddle jumper while it was in the air. Right after they landed and it came back from commercial, he was fiddling with the camcorder sans glasses. So somewhere around the time he was landing, the glasses did their disappearing trick.

On the very first puddle jumper, Ra did capture it, but could do nothing with it since he, nor any of his followers, had the ancients' gene. That puddle jumper eventually got buried and left for alt-universe people to find. I'm assuming they did this after defeating Ra and after he left Earth.

Citizen Joe was definitely a season highlight. I just loved it from start to finish. They always do that kind of injoke, poking gentle fun at themselves - and their more obssessed fans <g> - so well. It was just a delight all the way through.

Some fans, over on Gateworld, hate this kind of show because 'it's not about SG1'. But I love them all - Wormhole Extreme!, The Othery Guys, Avenger 2.0 - are all among my A grade favourites. I just love the humour, a big part of why I watch this show anyway. And I enjoy taking a look at SG1 from someone else's perspective, now and then. It's fun.

Too many favourite bits to quote - would be here all week. The scene in the infirmary though - Sam and Daniel's reactions to Joe and the whole Daniel/Jack conversation about Jack having his home broken into again - just crack me up every time I watch it. The briefing room scene too. Jack's disappointment that all of Joe's stories - based primarily on his written reports - were rejected by publishers is wonderful and, of course, the fact that he's been having visions of Joe's life for years and never thought it was odd.

And how could I forget the WAFFy telephone conversation between Sam and Jack at the start? Plus, any episode that has scenes in Jack's house is a winner with me. I am seriously in love with that man's house. I swear, if I ever won the lottery, I'd buy a plot of land up in the Highlands and employ an architect to watch SG1 episodes and come up with a building plan.

I love the scenes in the kitchen. Especially the one after the flashbacks end. Jack's casual reaching into the drawer for the gun, "But this one is." Just love that that explains his total unconcern at the start when Joe bursts in waving his 'gun'. Of course Jack would recognise instantly that it was fake. And the "First of all, Joe, I am not a terrible ping pong player!" LOL. Poor Jack. Oozing wounded ego there.

Joe: Well, why don't you go finish your chores and then I'll tell you how it ends.
Joe's son: Chores?! What are we - Amish?

Joe's assistant: They rejected Hathor?! But that was gold!



BTW, I thought Dan WhoseSurnameICanNeverSpell did excellently in the role. The only time he failed for me was when Joe is reacting to seeing Daniel die. Then he sounded exactly like Homer Simpson to me. <g> Other than that though, I didn't make the connection once in the whole hour.

LabRat