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#149263 - 12/23/05 04:18 AM WMBE Outline - what to do?
KathyB Offline

Merriwether

Registered: 04/22/03
Posts: 1526
Loc: Indiana
OK, maybe I should have made a poll instead of posting, but I didn't feel like coming up with a bunch of options to chose from, so let me just explain the situation and try to get some feedback. smile

As many of you know, I haven't written for L&C for awhile. After getting some recent feedback on two of my stories, however, I pulled out the notes I had done for the third (and final) part of the series and realized just how extensive they are ... and it got me wondering if I had any options other than just leaving them unfinished on my hard drive. (Beyond the obvious, that is.) If you haven't figured it out from the subject line, I'm talking about "When More Becomes Everything", which is, of course, the third part of the trilogy begun with "When Friends Become Lovers" and "When Lovers Become More."

My outline is ... well, long. Really long. 91 bullet points long. 8800+ words long. For the *outline*. And it's pretty detailed. Not just a few words here and there, but full paragraphs and snips of dialogue, written as if I was telling the story of what was going to happen. Kind of like as if someone was telling you about a movie they saw -- it's not as good as actually seeing the movie yourself, but still, it might be kind of interesting to read.

Or would it? That's my dilemma.

The story, had I ever finished it, would have been easily longer than the first two stories put together. Which is probably why I was never able to really dig in -- it was kind of overwhelming. In the back of my mind, I kept hoping that I would find the time/muse to finish it, but after this length of time, I have to admit that it's just not going to happen.

So, the question becomes, what now?

Would anyone be interested in reading this thing? Just to, you know, see what was supposed to happen in the final part? In addition to the 8800 word outline, I've also got about 6000 words written -- a tiny fraction of what the story would have been, but ... they're there and not doing anyone any good just sitting on my hard drive.

So what do you think? I can't archive the story, obviously, since it's not a *story*. I could post the files here, but I'd hate to set some type of precedent which leads my fellow Board Admins to put my picture up on a dart board. (I can just see it now, some eager young newbie comes along and says, "Oh, look, this fandom lets authors just post notes instead of real stories! I've got a bunch of those ..." wink ) Have I earned a dispensation, or should I try to find a host for the files, and just post the links here?

Or maybe I need to be committed for having delusions of grandeur for even thinking anyone would want to read my story notes in the first place ...

Help me sort this out, guys!

Kathy

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#149264 - 12/23/05 04:45 AM Re: WMBE Outline - what to do?
Capes Offline
Member

Registered: 10/22/05
Posts: 378
Loc: The very Spanish part of the M...
Although it breaks my heart to think of never seeing the finale to this trilogy--b/c I love both prior parts very much--I would rather read the notes than have nothing. Maybe posting it here would be okay, as long as there was some advisory note saying that this was unusual?

There is some precedent as we have the notes from three unfinished works by The Gorn. I have read them, and while it does give me a pain every time I read them, I still have enjoyed what there was.

Although, are you suuuure you don't want to write it? Huh? smile
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#149265 - 12/23/05 04:55 AM Re: WMBE Outline - what to do?
jackiek Offline
Top Banana

Registered: 12/15/04
Posts: 1390
Loc: Canada
Kathy, I was sooo excited when I saw your post. I think you already know how I feel. I would love to see anything and everything on any of your stories. If you decide to not post them here can you please please please send them to me?!

Quote:
Although, are you suuuure you don't want to write it? Huh?
I'll second this one. I know I've mentioned it before but I figure a little more nagging can't hurt. wink

Jackie
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#149266 - 12/23/05 05:11 AM Re: WMBE Outline - what to do?
LabRat Offline

Nobel Peace Prize Winner

Registered: 04/23/03
Posts: 9155
Loc: Scotland
Well, you wouldn't be the first, Kathy - remember the Gorn did this with her last 'unfinished' story? So there is a precedent. And, besides, rules are all well and good, but I'd hate to think we were so bound up in them that there's no leeway for this kind of thing, now and then. What harm would it do?

The Gorn's story was kind of a bittersweet experience for me. I hated that I'd never get to read the complete story, all written up.

But at the same time, I really enjoyed reading the bit of story, complete with notes, that was there.

By the sounds of it you might have even more material than that story of The Gorn's did.

So, yeah, I'd vote for posting it.

And if, at any point, you want to finish it, you still could. I don't think anyone would object just because you'd already posted the outline. wink

EDIT: Should have read the previous comments first. laugh See Rachel's pretty much said the same thing. Definitely, I agree with the concept of 'better something than nothing'. That's what it came down to in the end reading The Gorn's story and I'm sure it would be the same for yours.


LabRat smile
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#149267 - 12/23/05 05:23 AM Re: WMBE Outline - what to do?
groobie Offline
Features Writer

Registered: 12/15/03
Posts: 987
Loc: Riverside, California
Your series was fabulous! I'd rather have something than nothing - I vote for posting! smile Susan
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#149268 - 12/23/05 10:06 AM Re: WMBE Outline - what to do?
amciotola Offline

Hack from Nowheresville

Registered: 04/22/03
Posts: 249
Loc: Pennsylvania
Quote:
I can't archive the story, obviously, since it's not a *story*.
Wanna bet?? Where is it?!

dance dance
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#149269 - 12/23/05 04:36 PM Re: WMBE Outline - what to do?
HatMan Offline
Member

Registered: 04/24/03
Posts: 2564
Loc: Third star to the right and st...
I'm going to disagree with the pack here.

I don't want to see the notes.

For some stories, maybe, but for this? Heck no. The notes would have plot details and stuff, but they wouldn't have those rich, beautiful, flowing scenes that really set the series apart. The ones that just take you with them, carry you into that world, and show you what it really looks like.

In place of that, I'd be getting the bare bones. The skeleton of the thing. Which would just be wrong. Sad, too.

Not only that, but (here's the part where I get mean), posting the notes would give you closure (to a degree). You'd say "okay, I did something with them, and that's good enough." And so, another couple years down the road, when you might suddenly think "hey, maybe I can write it, after all," you won't have as strong a motivation to do it. It could be the critical difference.

So, not only would we not get the key part of the experience, but we'd be hurting the chances (however slim they may seem at the moment) of ever getting it.

Thanks for the offer, but, speaking (of course) for myself... no thanks.

Paul
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#149270 - 12/23/05 07:36 PM Re: WMBE Outline - what to do?
Incognito Offline
Member

Registered: 07/13/05
Posts: 247
I understand what Paul is saying. My answer, though, would be that if you are absolutely certain that there is no chance that you would ever be inspired to pick it up again, then I hope you post the notes. But if there is a tiny smidgen of doubt in your mind, and you'd allow for the possibility of one day deciding to take another whack at the outline and coming up with a complete story, even if you don't foresee it happening in the near future, then I say it's best to let it percolate.
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#149271 - 12/24/05 02:51 AM Re: WMBE Outline - what to do?
Tank Offline
Merriwether

Registered: 04/24/03
Posts: 1989
Loc: The edge of civilization, Minn...
I have to agree with Paul's reasoning. It would be like sitting down to a favorite meal, but only eating a couple of forkfulls. The experience might be pleasant for those few moments, but would you really be sated? And how would you feel leaving all that potential enjoyment sitting on the plate?

There is something to be said for "Not knowing what you've missed".

I offer another possible scenario if those notes are 'made public'. Insessant nagging. You don't think an army of gentle readers, once they are given a taste of what could be, wouldn't relentlessly be 'on your case' to write the third and supposedly final part of the story?

Tank (who thinks that Kathy should just give in gracefully, edit the notes to a more manageable length, and just write the darn thing)

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#149272 - 12/24/05 08:12 AM Re: WMBE Outline - what to do?
HatMan Offline
Member

Registered: 04/24/03
Posts: 2564
Loc: Third star to the right and st...
I'm back, on a quick flyby... (Shouldn't be tying up the one phone line in the house for too long at this hour...)

I'm not sure what would be so difficult about a poll, Kathy. One question, two options. "Should I post the notes?" "Yes" or "no." Might be useful at this point, just to see what those who aren't posting are thinking (it's easier to vote than to post, and it feels like a vote counts more than a "me too" post).

Just a thought.

Paul
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#149273 - 12/24/05 05:39 PM Re: WMBE Outline - what to do?
RL Offline
Member

Registered: 04/24/03
Posts: 1206
Loc: Pacific Northwest
I'm with Paul and Tank. I would love to see the trilogy finished some day and could see posting the notes as a disincentive to ever write it. LOL, guess the guys are sticking together on this one.

It breaks my heart to say it, since WFBL and WLBM were the two stories that got me into this fandom in the first place, but I would prefer to not see the notes but would be one of the first in line to read the finished product. Hint, hint. wink

How sure are you that you won't be writing it some day?
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#149274 - 12/29/05 06:45 AM Re: WMBE Outline - what to do?
KathyB Offline

Merriwether

Registered: 04/22/03
Posts: 1526
Loc: Indiana
Thanks for the feedback, everyone ... can't say as it helps me decide what to do, with the different opinions, but I guess it's what I should have expected. smile

Quote:
How sure are you that you won't be writing it some day?
That's really what it comes down to, doesn't it? Obviously I have no way of telling the future, so I can't say that I'll *never* write L&C again. But honestly, is it looking very likely? Given that my last story (M2) was submitted 2 years ago this month, and the previous part to this particular series (WLBM) was submitted 3 1/2 years ago (not to mention the fact that I've been actively writing for another fandom, which means other stories/characters currently have my attention), I have to say it's pretty doubtful. Plus if I ever did decide to actively jump back into L&C, I do have other unfinished stories on my hard drive besides this one ... stories that wouldn't require 1000 K worth of text to tell. So finishing WMBE -- at least not before we're all in the old age home -- doesn't seem like a strong bet.

So I guess I have some more thinking to do.

Kathy

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#149275 - 12/29/05 07:32 AM Re: WMBE Outline - what to do?
BanAnna Offline

Columnist

Registered: 04/22/03
Posts: 698
Loc: Glendale, CA
I can see both sides to this dilemma, so I'm torn and I don't know if I can really offer an opinion other than to say...

Quote:
So finishing WMBE -- at least not before we're all in the old age home -- doesn't seem like a strong bet.
... that we'll all have a lot more time to read and write once we're in the old age home. And some of us don't mind waiting that long. Just food for thought, Kathy. wink

~Anna

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#149276 - 12/29/05 07:55 AM Re: WMBE Outline - what to do?
KSaraSara Offline

Kerth

Registered: 08/14/03
Posts: 2077
Loc: Las Vegas, NV
ROTFL Anna!! rotflol

And ditto!! laugh

Sara
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#149277 - 12/29/05 09:00 AM Re: WMBE Outline - what to do?
DocJill Offline

Moderator

Registered: 04/24/03
Posts: 328
Loc: Cincinnati, OH USA
/me pulls Anna into a corner to conspire....I'm thinking of a certain out-of-the-way cabin in Maryland, tying Kathy to a chair with a load of L&C tapes and a laptop. (We'd let her watch the occasional Nanny tape, because we're nice, but mostly L&C.) I think this is more reasonable than the old age home... Are you with me?

Kathy, disregard this post - you didn't hear nothin'! wink

Jill goofy (who is torn as well!)
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#149278 - 12/29/05 02:01 PM Re: WMBE Outline - what to do?
BanAnna Offline

Columnist

Registered: 04/22/03
Posts: 698
Loc: Glendale, CA
Jill, you Laura and Kaylle grab Kathy! I'll get to Indiana to watch the kids so she doesn't have any excuses. wink

While you're at it, see if you can tie Kaylle to another chair and get her to finish some of those wips of hers. *G*

~Anna

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#149279 - 12/29/05 02:47 PM Re: WMBE Outline - what to do?
Shadow Offline
Member

Registered: 04/24/03
Posts: 3627
Loc: Gulf Shores, AL
LOL.
'Why isn't anyone posting anymore?'

'Uhhhh well a lot of people are tied up right now...literally.'

Honestly, my only thought about the notes is, it's kind of like reading the back of a movie box you're never going to watch. That being said, well, I still have no real opinion on whether or not you should post them. But count me in the old-age homes group If you decide to write the thing when half of us are in homes, I'll be knocking people over with my cane to be first in line. wink

JD
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#149280 - 12/29/05 03:36 PM Re: WMBE Outline - what to do?
eminMN Offline
Member

Registered: 01/16/05
Posts: 77
Loc: Minnesota
I can understand both sides of the "to post or not to post" debate.

"When Friends Become Lovers" and "When Lovers Become More" are two of my very favorite Lois and Clark fanfic stories. When I first discovered the L&C fanfic world, they were two of the first that I read and truly were the stories that got me hooked. After reading them several times, I am still affected by the sheer power and quality of the writing.

With that being said, I would LOVE it if "When More Becomes Everything" becomes a full story (even if we are all old and gray.) I wonder, is it a possiblity to scale back the magnitude of the story? Would this increase the possibility of the story actually being written? If so, I promise to post all sorts of feedback on each part written!

But, if the story simply isn't going to be written, I prefer to fall back on a phrase a teacher of mine from years ago liked to say: "Something is better than nothing."

While the notes would definitely not be as satisfying as a fully developed story, I for one would like to see the notes if that is all that is available.

Even though I am one who does want to see the notes, that still does not solve the issue of whether or not to post the notes on the Boards. Perhaps it does not have to be a "to post or not to post" situation. There is a possible middle ground. If a list were compiled on this thread of people who want to see the notes; then maybe (if she is willing) Kathy could simply e-mail the notes to the people who want them.

And you never know, maybe some feedback generated from the notes may inspire the muse to demand the story be finished.

If this sounds like a good idea, you can add my e-mail address to the list of people who would like to be e-mailed the notes. (my e-mail address is available in my profile.)

-Em
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#149281 - 12/29/05 07:24 PM Re: WMBE Outline - what to do?
KSaraSara Offline

Kerth

Registered: 08/14/03
Posts: 2077
Loc: Las Vegas, NV
Quote:
While you're at it, see if you can tie Kaylle to another chair and get her to finish some of those wips of hers. *G*
Ooh! Good idea, Anna! You should threaten her by witholding pie from her. devil

Now... will witholding The Nanny eps (but for a few) be enough motivation for Kathy?

Sara wink
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#149282 - 12/31/05 08:16 AM Re: WMBE Outline - what to do?
Kaylle Offline

Moderator

Registered: 04/24/03
Posts: 345
Loc: Ohio
Quote:
While you're at it, see if you can tie Kaylle to another chair and get her to finish some of those wips of hers. *G*
Hmm, there's the Star Wars one, or the Robin Hood story... Oh, you meant L&C? Lol, seven hours left of the year... Doesn't seem likely smile And I wasn't the one demanding pie!

As for WMBE... I have really mixed feelings about seeing the outline. As everyone said, something is better than nothing, and I'd love to see what you had in mind. But there's a sense of admitting defeat... and I hate to think that posting the outline means the story will never see the light of day in any other form.

So put me on the list of people who'd like to see it, but only if it isn't a nail in the coffin wink

Kaylle
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