Well, the first thing I would say is that I hope you're not underestimating the value of a "great vignette."
Oh, definitely not. I'm just tired of not being able to write longer fics as well, and I think it's affecting my vignette plot ideas too. I'll go to write a vignette that's popped into my head while trying to write a longer story, and the vignette will turn out way too cute, or way too "First, he did this, then she did that . . ." for what I was planning, all because it feels like the longer story is turning out like crap and is too short already.
As to your original question, I seem to have the opposite problem lately. I'm very capable of writing ten pages in which absolutely nothing happens. Sometimes this is an OK thing, if the ten pages manage to advance characterization or give necessary insight into the characters' emotions, and sometimes it's just verbal diarrhea.
Yup, "verbal diarrhea" pretty much describes what happens to my vignettes when I get frustrated with trying to write a longer fic.
If you have a story that you think needs fleshing out, then I would suggest you look for places where you're telling the readers something and try to show them instead.
That's the part I always have trouble with. I get the whole "Show, don't tell" thing, but I can never spot the places in my own fics where that applies--it always seems that I've said everything I can say about whatever subject.
As for beta readers . . . I've had a couple before (
none in FoLCdom yet), but only one of them (for an original story I'd written) had really told me about that type of thing.
Not to mention, I tend to get impatient for feedback when I've written a story and (bad habit, I know) totally skip the beta stage so that I can post the story on the boards here, submit it to the archive, and get that feedback.
One writer (I think it was Meredith Knight, but I'm not going to look it up, so someone feel free to correct me if I'm wrong...) showed us Clark compulsively making sandwiches out of random ingredients in his refrigerator while Lois was supposed to be on a date with Lex Luthor. So instead of "Clark was lonely," "Clark was jealous," or "Clark was at loose ends," we get an endearing image of him trying to fill his time and take his mind off her date by making sandwiches. And later, of course, Lois bites into one of the sandwiches (tomato and peanut butter, IIRC!) and the author was able to use the scene just that bit more. Lovely.
I remember that fic! I think I might've read it twice now--that's how many times I've been through the archive at least. It was an interesting thing--I'd never thought of Clark doing anything other than throwing himself into more Superman stuff when he was trying to get his mind off of things, and that was pretty original.
When I write a WiP, I try to throw "extra" elements into early parts that I might be able to use later.
*Shudder* I did that--once. Although, I didn't really call them "extra" at the time--I was just following what I'd thought was the style I wanted to emulate. I threw two whole, completely unnecessary sub-plots into a (somewhat short--14 pages or so) Star Trek fic I was writing (the very first fanfic I ever wrote), and when my dad's best friend got ahold of it, he tore it up (to my--at first--embarrassment, and then gratitude)--my first beta reader, and that was before I even knew I was writing fanfiction (I'd never even heard the term before I got into Buffy the Vampire Slayer a few years later)!
I don't know if you work with a beta reader or not, but I do think that second set of eyes and impressions can be awfully helpful with edits of this type. If you can find someone honest enough to tell you that her eyes glazed over during this bit and that she was really hoping you'd do more with that section, it can be oh-so-helpful. Because when you're writing it, it's often hard to evaluate that kind of thing yourself.
I know exactly what you mean. But before I get a beta, maybe it would be a good idea to at least know where one of my WIPs is going first. Then again, maybe a beta could help me by looking over my outlines? Hmm . . . something to think about.
I like vigenettes and some can be breathtakingly beautiful, but personally I find a good B-plot ladden A-plot the most satisfying thing to read.
Oh, definitely. Not that vignettes and/or shorts can't have both B- and/or A-plots, but I prefer a story I can really sink my teeth into, and if a longer fic is poorly organized/written or doesn't have much substance (despite good or bad organization/writing), then it just doesn't do anything for me. Heaven forbid I should ever churn out a poorly organized, poorly written longer fic
myself!
I think that's also part of my troubles--I get so caught up in trying to make the story GOOD that I leave out things that seem frivolous to me, although they might not really
be frivolous.
The worst part is wanting so desperately to get to the other side, but knowing that you still have a lot of stuff to resolve in terms of the A-plot.
I'd just like to have one epic (or a half-sized epic--100KB-300KB or so . . .)--and possibly sequels. The trouble is, that like you, I also desperately want to get to the other side, and all that writing seems so daunting to me that I either procrastinate so much that I lose interest in the story (or the fandom--that's happened to me before, and I'm determined it won't happen here--I've loved the show too long for that), or the story never even gets started.
When it works for you as a method, it can be a terrific tool.
Oh, definitely. I think my problem is that I've been trying to use my vignette/short method to write longer fics--just let them flow from my brain to the keyboard as they come (or jot down a note in some margin somewhere about the story idea until such time as I CAN let the story flow).
I tend to forget ideas I've had for stories unless I write them down, and for a longer fics, I think an outline would be better than just margin notes, since I'd have to keep them in a coherent order.
I'd still put the same TYPE of notes in the outline (two or three phrases that I'm sure will jog my memory about a great scene or story arc that I've thought of)--there'd just be more of them, and they'd be lined up in the order I want them in the story.
In a way, I guess you could say that my margin notes are usually my "outline" (even though there's usually only one note) for my vignettes. For longer stories, I think I'll go with a more formal type of outline (indented numbered and lettered lists of notes)--change my method depending on what type of story I want to write, you know?
My usual method of beginning a story is that I get a series of mental images - snatches of dialogue, parts of a situation - and I jot them down in a file while they're fresh in my head.
I can't write the whole scene until I've gotten to that point in the story. Which isn't to say that I don't get ideas for future scenes while I'm still in the beginning of writing. I just can't write them out of order--I'm a very linear thinker/writer. But I do write a little margin note--possibly with a line or two of dialogue if it's something I REALLY want to remember to use--in the margin of the page I'm writing on, or on the printout of what I've written so far. (I take printouts to work with me so that I can write on my breaks without having to send the story files to my computer at work, which is technically frowned upon.)
Which is not to say that outlines aren't wonderful tools and that my stories wouldn't be better if I used one. I just don't. I do, of course, have a mental outline that I work from, and I usually have a series of key scenes along the way that I *know* will be in the story. Sometimes I go ahead and write them and sometimes I don't, but one way or another they're there, giving me benchmarks to meet along the way.
. . . when a fic is more than ten parts or so, I consider whoever gets all the turns and twists down sans previous mapping to be really, really talented. And very, very mentally organized. To my scatterbrained self that's as awe-inspiring as being a genius.
Same here. I tend to read a LOT of fics on the archive, one right after the other. I would never be able to sit back down to write more of a fic I had left sitting if I didn't have a written plan somewhere--I'd get my own story lines mixed up with everyone else's!
I also, like LabRat, have been forced to "timeline" on a couple of occasions, though I find the activity tedious in the extreme.
I don't have much trouble with timelines in my own stories. Usually, I know how much time needs to pass between scenes and stuff, and I frequently re-read what I've written in hopes of having an idea for what to write next (or just to re-familiarize myself with the story and what I've written so far after a long procrastination).
But sometimes, when I'm READING stories, I have no idea how much time has passed. I mean, one scene, Lois'll be pregnant or something, and then in the next scene you won't get any clues about time until a page or two in, and then all of a sudden, the baby's five years old! That's kind of annoying, but tolerable, I guess. The worst part is if the author didn't put a scene break or anything (besides a new paragraph) between the two!
Thanks for all your great comments and ideas! I've been procrastinating working on a couple of stories, but as soon as I'm done procrastinating, I'm going to put some of these in practice.