... before I go utterly nuts and lose whatever is left of my patience (which, admittedly, is not much).

I'm looking for someone foolproof with a bit of time and lots of patience, who knows everything there is to know about Windows XP and the I-River H340. Before I do something rash. Such as throw that €400 toy out the window. :p Or send it back to Expansys and tell them to stuff it where the sun don't shine.

It was supposed to be simple, easy, plug-and-play, use it like a harddrive, create playlists on the go, USB 2 fast transfer (hah! Like over 10 hours to transfer 5 GB is *fast*!), and so on. It's none of that. I've gone through the whole user manual (something I normally never do, but I was really desperate) and I'm discovering more and more things that just won't function. Not to mention there doesn't seem to be a way to make playlists on the go. Even though I read reviews saying it was possible. I visited many forums to see if other users were having the same issues as I did, and some mentioned the slowness of the transfer, but none of what the other users suggested to fix the problem worked for me.

I spent ages weighing the pros and cons of buying that player, especially as it was more expensive than what I originally wanted to spend, so ARRRRGGHHHHHH!

If you can help (no, Roger, telling me I should get a Mac and an I-Pod is *no* help ), please email me at the address in my profile. I'll be forever grateful!

Kaethel (wishing something would go RIGHT!)

Poor you! {{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{hugs}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}

Nothing worse than a damn machine that won't do what it should.

Can't help, being a technowombat, but hope you get it sorted out soon, Kae.

Apart from anything else, I'm still waiting for all those wonderful music videos you were going to do off the back of this music machine.


LabRat

Unfortunately, I can't help you, but I do feel your pain! iTunes decided at 2:30 in the morning that I didn't need half my playlists or the last, oh, 100ish songs I'd added into my library. You're a lot nicer than I am, though. I would have at least called them already and told them to stuff it where the sun doesn't shine.

Good luck!

Jen

Well, I don't know everything about the H340, but I do know that every review and bit of info I've seen (about the US model, anyway) says that you can't make playlists on the go. In fact, that was the major sticking point of at least one review I read.

You can, however, create playlists using WinAmp or Windows Media Player and copy those playlists to the player along with the music. Windows Media Player 10 should, actually, have just about all the tools you need from the comp side of things. It creates playlists, it manages your song library, it rips CDs... it's actually a bit of Microsoft programming I'm fairly impressed with.

Similarly, transfer speed was listed as a problem in several reviews, and I only ever found two solutions. The first was to use the Data port rather than the Media port (which supposedly helps somewhat). The second was to remember that you're transferring a lot of data (several megs for just one song) and therefore to be patient and let the poor overwhelmed serial port do its thing. Although, now that I think about it, 5 gigs in 10 hours is about 140kbps, which is fairly slow by current standards. (Actually, looking it up, that's about 1/10th the estimated max for USB2, though it is fairly close to the max for USB low speed.)

Not sure what to tell you, Kae. My sister hasn't reported any similar problems with her H320. I can't say I've heard good things about iRiver's non-automated support, but it may be worth a try. If so much is simply failing to work properly, it could be that you have a defective player.

Anyway, I have plenty of patience but unfortunately limited knowledge. If there's something I may be able to help with, let me know and I'd be happy to give it a shot. Otherwise... good luck, and sorry you have to deal with this.

Paul

Hmm. Well, I thought that since the H140 filled every criteria I'd described (including the create playlists on the go thing), the H340 would do that just as well (since it's pretty much the upgraded version of the player). I have to confess that if I can't create playlists on the go, it *is* a big disappointment. It was one major feature that I really wanted.

I refuse to believe I have a defective player. I've had enough trouble with computers and drives over the years. It just *can't* happen constantly.

Paul, could you ask your sister if she can move files around and read files on her computer *from* the I-River?

Also, it seems I can't even eject the drive safely. It doesn't appear on my "safely remove hardware" icon. And when I unplug it, to replug it and have it detected by the computer again, I have to reboot the computer.

Kae

I'll try to remember, Kae. I know she had it up and working well a couple weeks ago, but since then, she's been fairly busy with this new thing... what was it called again? ... oh, right. A "baby." Sadly lacking in the plug-and-play department, but I hear it's expandable and self-upgrading.

Speaking of plug-and-play, not being able to disconnect it properly sounds very odd. I wonder if the problem could simply be that the comp is still not recognizing it properly. When I looked into that before (the post I made and then edited clean), I found an entry in "Ask iRiver" that said that sometimes you may need to manually assign the player a drive letter. IIRC, you have to right-click on "My Computer," select "Manage," go to "Disk Management," find the player, right click on it, select "change drive letter," and then assign it a letter.

I wonder, BTW, if you might be better off uninstalling all those drivers and things you weren't supposed to need (which might just be confusing Windows) and letting the comp take another crack at figuring out what the heck this new doodad plugged into its USB port is... You should be able to try that with System Restore.

Oh, one other thing... If the player appears in "My Computer," can you disconnect/"eject" it from there?

Paul

I had tried that selecting a letter for the drive thing. I can't. It doesn't give me the option. The player appears in My Computer, but then again when I right-click on it there's no option to eject it. I can't get rid of the drivers the way you suggest as my system restore is actually turned off (not sure why and not sure how to turn it back on), but earlier tonight I tried plugging the player to my desktop computer. I had the same issues as it asked me to install the drivers, which it wouldn't find of course. To install it on the laptop (and I assume it would be the same on the desktop), I had to go to the "add hardware wizard" thing.

Both computers, btw, run XP SP1, and the user manual certifies the player should be plug and play with this OS.

So I'm at a loss.

Kaethel

Very odd.

Well, my sister, as it turns out, is coming here for a few days. She'll be arriving sometime tomorrow. So, maybe while she's here, I can take a poke at her H320 and see what I can learn.

It does seem like the key to everything is that the system isn't properly recognizing the player. That might even explain it using USB low speed protocal instead of USB2 high speed.

I wonder if there's any kind of region encoding or something. There shouldn't be with a player, but I know that the EU version is slightly diffrent than the US version (the EU version, one review said, is able to play movies while the US version isn't).

I tried browsing the UK site, but I can't seem to find any actual content. The page indicates that there should be downloadables and FAQs and the "Ask iRiver" support tool and all sorts of stuff like that, but I don't see any of it on the page.

On the US side, I did find this software update but I'm not sure how much help it'll be for you. It's a database tool which may allow you to create playlists, after all, but it doesn't look like it'll do anything for the problem of the system not properly recognizing the player.

The US FAQ, unfortunately, says that US players require US firmware. I assume it's the same for EU. So there is a regional component to things.

Where did you buy the player? Where was it made?

Back on the US side, "Ask iRiver" insists that, even if the comp is asking for drivers, you shouldn't need them as long as you have XP service pack 1 or higher (and preferably WMP 10).

Also finding more pointing to using the DATA port over the MEDIA port. Aparantly, the DATA port doesn't even need SP1 or WMP10.

On a side note, it does mention differences between the North American version and the European version. Aparantly, the NA version is designed to work better with WMP10 while the EU version is designed to have more USB portability.

So.. I don't know what else to suggest. Like I said, I'll take a look at my sister's H320 and see if I can figure anything out.

Paul

I don't have an MP3 player, but I was looking at the United Kingdom webpage for the iRiver (I chose UK because it's in English; seems just like the page for France) to see if they had any extra information, and noticed something.

This may sound like a stupid question, but I was looking at the picture, and apparently there are two USB ports on the iRiver. I found this PDF file which seems to explain the two USB ports and their use. Are you downloading online music to the iRiver (and using the "MEDIA" port) or downloading music from your computer (and using the "DATA" port)?
Maybe you are using the wrong USB port.

malu

I bought the player off a French website, so it's the EU version. Paul, I'll take a look at that software to create playlists, though I need to be sure it's going to work with the European iRiver.

Last night, Annette made me download and install MusicMatch, which is seems to be more normal speed for transferring. However, it was screwing up my folders and using each track's personal data to transfer the file (which would be fine and dandy if I could move files around and rename stuff once on the iRiver, but it's not the case), so I had to go back to using normal copy/paste.

I'm using the media port, for the one and only reason that when in the data port, I can't access the iRiver at all.

And that's the thing. It seems to me that the player isn't faulty but it simply not at all what I expected. I thought it'd be like my external hard drive, but it's not. It's much more complicated use, and it's basically a pain in the backside. And it was way more expensive than my external hard drive. I just wish I could rename files, create folders and move things around once they're on the iRiver. I've pretty much given up on the hope to create playlists on the go, even though that was the *main* thing I wanted from the player.

Kae

That's exactly it, Kae. It is supposed to function like an external hard drive. The problem is that the system doesn't seem to be properly recognizing it, and I can't figure out why.

Have you tried plugging it in via the DATA port and then manually assigning it a drive letter? I know you've tried both steps seperately, but have you done them together?

I'm trying to think what else I can suggest. Only other thing that comes to mind is kind of risky. SP2, it seems, is (for whatever odd reason) a lot more laptop friendly than desktop friendly. It also seems to be more iRiver friendly. So... have you ever tried installing SP2 on the laptop?

Oh, that reminds me... Have you tried fiddling with the System Restore settings? With the US version of windows, you can access it like this:

Start -> Programs -> Accessories -> System Tools -> System Restore

The right half of the window allows you to revert to an earlier restore point or create a new one. The left explains about system restore and, at the bottom, has a link to the settings.

Settings can also be accessed by right-clicking "My Computer," selecting properties, and then clicking the "System Restore" tab at the back.

There are basically two settings. One is a checkbox that lets you turn off System Restore. The other is a slider that lets you determine how much disk space System Restore is allowed to use.

So, if you haven't already, make sure the checkbox is clear and that the slider is far enough over that there's room for a new restore point.

The other thing you can try is to manually create a restore point at reglar intervals and before major changes.

Hope some of this helps.

Paul

Paul, I'll reply to your specific post once I've tried some of that stuff.

However, I did some more searching around on the net and found many reviews (WHY didn't I find them before I bought the player?!?!?) talking about the same problems I've been having. It turns out that the iRiver H340 is *not* worth its price, and it's got a lot of technical flaws which make it a disappointment to many buyers. It certainly is a big disappointment to me.

I might try to sell it on Ebay and use the money to get something better and cheaper.

Kaethel

Paul, to be honest I don't think the system or even the player are at fault. The player is being detected by my computer as an audio device, which it is.

I've looked around on the web and found out many negative reviews about the H340. For some reason (HAH) those don't appear on commercial websites, but it seems lots of users have had the same frustrations with their H340 as I do with mine. In a nutshell, it's not a bad player. The sound quality is excellent, the coloured screen is beautiful (but screen quality is really *not* what I expect the most from an MP3 player), but it doesn't match the main criteria I wanted from a player. I think I must have been tired when I bought it, as I missed all the important stuff. It seems, though that most of the time websites make a big fuss of screen quality and they don't tell you much about playback functionalities. I guess I just don't have the same priorities as those websites.

Anyway, we'll see how it goes. It's way too far from what I needed for me to keep it, so unless a miracle happens and it turns out I'm doing things wrong, I'll try to sell it on Ebay. It is, after all, a brand new MP3 player with a 40 GB hard drive, a beautiful coloured screen ( :p ) and great sound quality.

Kaethel

Can you not return it to where you've bought it, Kaethel? We usually have a bit of a grace period here to return things that aren't working the way we thought that they should.

Sometimes there's a restocking charge, but it's got to be better than what you'd get on Ebay.

Irene

I checked that, Irene, but the Expansys website says they only take back items that have arrived less than 7 days before (I've had mine for 10 days :p ) and are still wrapped in mint condition. Like they expect you to figure out it's not right for you *before* you unwrap it. :p So that doesn't seem to be an option, I'm afraid.

Kaethel

Yeah, for real. Like they expect us to have some kind of psychic connection with our purchases before we open them.

Have you tried badgering them about it? Again, I never claimed I was that nice <g>, but I have talked a few stores into letting me make an exchange for something that turned out to be not right for me. The least they can do is just say no...

Jen

I wouldn't let that put you off, Kae. Over here, they wouldn't get away with that. They can put it on their paperwork all they like, but the law states that goods have to do the job they're supposed to and they are obliged to do something about it if they don't. Frankly, that kind of statement isn't worth the paper it's written on. Quite literally.

Don't know what French law on this is, obviously, but I wouldn't automatically assume that their statement can fly. I'd definitely push on it. Do you have an equivalent of the Citizens' Advice Bureau? Somewhere that will let you know your consumer rights for free?

LabRat

Sorry, Kae. I did see some of those reviews on epinions . Some people seemed to have a lot of trouble, some felt it was worth it for the player, some didn't have any trouble at all. I'm sorry it's not working out for you.

I'll still take a look at my sister's (if she rememebers to bring it) and see if I can figure anything out. Doubtful, at this point, but worth a try.

Good luck selling it (and finding a replacement), if that's what you do.

Paul

This is what the Expansys France webpage says on returns (translated from French using BabelFish, since I can't read French):
----------------------------
2.1 Right of retractation
2.1.1 If you are not satisfied with the goods, you have a 7 days deadline as from the date of reception for us to restore it in his state of origin (packing, accessories, note...), we will carry out a refunding in the 30 days following the return. The expenses of return remain with your load. The turned over, damaged, damaged incomplete articles or dirtied by the customer are not shown.

2.1.2 In accordance with the L121-20-2 article of the code of consumption, the right of retractation cannot be exerted for the articles which can be copied (CD, DVD, software, etc.) except if they are turned over to us not loosened.

2.2 Other returns
2.2.1 If products are delivered defective or damaged or if a defect appears in the 14 days after the delivery, we will refund you completely or we will carry out a replacement of the product in question, according to your choice and availabilities'. This as of the return of the goods in our buildings.

2.2.2 If one or the products turned over is not defective, that the returned goods include a software which was opened, or which they are not turned over in their packing of origin, an allowance of 25% of the selling price of the product concerned will be applied.
Certain articles coming from country other than France will be delivered with their food of origin and an adapter for the European format. It will be deduced 5 Euro on refunding for any article from this type turned over without its adapter.

2.2.3 No right to repossess could be exerted for the articles which can be copied (CD, DVD, software, etc.) except if they are turned over to us within the times and not loosened.
--------------------------

Apparently you can return, but you might lose 25% of your money (although I think 100 Euros sounds like a lot and may not be worth it).

malu

Well, the thing is that Kae should be able to plug it in via the Data port, have the comp recognize it as an external hard drive (as opposed to plugging it into the Media port and having it recognized as an audio device), drag and drop files as she likes, and get transfer speeds 10 times higher than she's getting. (That's what worked for a couple people having the same sort of problems she's having now.)

That isn't happening. It may be a faulty design. It may be poor programming. I don't know. I think, though, that a case can be made for it being defective, which means that, if she returns it within 14 days (even if it's been opened), she should get her full money back.

Paul

Thanks a lot, Malu. For some reason, they say something different on their customer service page (they talk about a 7 days delay even for faulty devices ). But what you found sounds rather promising, and I sent an email to them last night describing the problem and asking for either a refund or an exchange with a machine of a different make. So we'll see. Crossing fingers it will work out, because at this point I'm tearing my hair out.

Kae (who would have exploded long ago without you guys' support!)

I wasn't sure if there is an Expansys store for each country separately (each with its own conditions), or if they only had the conditions in different languages.

But I'm glad the information may somehow help you, Kaethel.

Let's cross our fingers that they refund all your money so you can look for a good deal and find exactly what you want.

Let us know of the outcome.

malu