Lois & Clark Forums Forums Fan Fiction Fanfic Related Nagging -- good or bad?

Hey, where's that fic you said you were working on?
Or the sequel I think you need to the story you think is finished?
You started it already, right?
It'll be ready maybe tomorrow, right?

Am I driving you crazy yet?

I was wondering if nagging could sometimes be less helpful than we'd like... just thinking about how I feel being nagged and seeing other authors nagged, and nagging them myself I know I've felt a little pressured sometimes. I mean, I really like knowing that there are people out there who want to read stuff from me... but it can get to be a bit much.

Authors, do you ever not want to go online, 'cause you know you'll get pounced on and asked about it as soon as you get on channel? Or maybe it seems like everyone's expectations are *so* high that it'd be impossible for you to produce anything good enough, so you don't even want to try. Or do you ever feel like people think you're just a walking fiction machine, not a real person with a real life? Am I nuts?

PJ

Well, I've never taken nagging that seriously - or been that serious about nagging.

I guess the bottom line though is if it bothers you just say so. I can't imagine anyone would continue to nag an author if they'd made their preferences known.

LabRat

As I said on the list, I don't mind the nagging. In fact, if I don't get nagged I'm afraid that I'm not doing a good enough job and that people are getting bored with my work, so please, nag me. I promise not to be offended!

Nan

Even though I've rarely/never been really nagged the way some people are, I am always envoius of those people who are nagged mercilessly. At least it shows that people are interested in their stories and want to read more. However, I know that people can get bogged down in the nagging and expectations and how it could discourage people from going on IRC. I know of someone who had just that problem last year, and she was really upset about it that even when she asked people to stop nagging her, the nagging continued, even though her coauthor had the story part that was to be posted, and she couldn't do anything about it. So I guess it's a good thing in moderation.

- Laura

Interesting topic, Pam.

As a reader, I used to nag a lot. Two things calmed me down a little: first, lack of time for reading; since I don't have time to read as much as I used to, I feel bad nagging authors whose stories I know I will read in the future, but can't read immediately. Still do it for some authors who need the occasional kick in the bum, though. But nagging (the amount I get these days) is just what I need to encourage me and reassure me that even though I'm a lot busier with real life than I used to be, my readers haven't forgotten me.

Kaethel

Every once in a while, I think a good natured nag is in order just to let people know that you're interested and looking forward to what they're working on. I generally don't nag too much because it's sort of like, okay, I'm not writing a thing right now because I'm too busy to even think about an idea for writing, yet I'm nagging other people to write when they're probably just as busy as I am. However, nagging doesn't bother me (mine comes from the art studio, not the fanfic world right now); I can take the pressure. :p

JD

Well, as I said on the ficlist, I don't have much personal experience with nagging. Which isn't necessarily a bad thing. I don't generally think about it too much, and I'm never quite sure what to do about it when someone actually does nag me. It confused me quite a bit when I was posting "Cape of Good Hope." It is nice to feel appreciated, but "plain old" FDK serves just as well, IMO.

I do recall friends complaining of over-nagging on various occasions, including at least one in which the "please stop. That's too much pressure" was ignored. Wish I could remember more detail.

Clearly, though, there are those who thrive on nagging, and those who simply appreciate it.

All of which (pretty much), i already posted to the ficlist.

The main reason I'm posting here is to say that I was shocked when I saw you opened this thread here, Pam. Wouldn't this be much better as a 2-question poll?

Something like this (only better planned...):

Question 1: How do you feel about nagging?

• love it/can't live without it
• it makes me feel appreciated
• I don't get much, but it sounds cool
• It's fine to a point, but sometimes it's too much
• I don't care
• I don't mind it, I guess...
• I don't get it/it's not for me
• It just puts pressure on me/I don't like it
• Other

Question 2: Do you nag?

• Yes. A lot. As a writer, I appreciate it, so
• I nag others, too.
• Yes. A lot. I don't write, but writers seem
• to appreciate it.
• Yes. A lot. It seems to be the way things are
• done.
• Yes. A lot. For a different reason.
• Yes. Sometimes. When I'm really enjoying a story, and especially after something like a big cliffhanger.
• etc.

Do you think that would help, or would it just be too hard to get options that cover enough?

Paul

Like Laura, I don't fall into the camp of writers who are relentlessly nagged. Thank goodness!

I'm thinking of those who have left us dangling on the precipice, and have for various reasons not come back to help us down. Those of us who are writing an Alphabet series, for example, or who ended Misery with a hint of more to come. Or Near Wild Heaven. That's a different kind of nag. The 'where is it?! we've been waiting!!' nag. I tell you, if it was me, and I had an audience waiting and expecting something great, and I had...nothing, I'd change my name and leave town.

That's just me, though.

Or even more difficult, MissyG and Leela, who are writing epics that are in progress, but tend to take breaks along the way. Hats off to them for resisting the 'where-have-you-gone? come-back-here!' nagging, and not writing simply to finish. I'd fold like a house of cards, be slapping stuff together in a cold sweat, just to get to the end, never mind logic or inspiration. I know. But I've said this before. I'm kind of a wimp under pressure.

For me, if I've got stuff that's working, that I'm excited about, then I love a few nags to push me along, and to confirm for me that it isn't crap. You know, the 'it's-not-crap' nags. Those are nice!

And I have found a lot of sympathy abounds for the writer who simply says, "I'm empty, clueless, directionless." Which, btw, is what I currently am!

CC

Well, a little bit of friendly nagging does no harm, in my opinion. What mostly goes on, anyway, is not so much nagging as supportive interest in an author's progress with their writing. Heck, it's nice to know that there are people out there who care about your work.

What does get wearing is when you get jumped on for a progress report as soon as you show your face online (and here I'm really just talking about IRC). Not only that, but every single time you appear, you get jumped on. That's when you start hitting that enter button which commits you to entering the channel very warily indeed!

Imagine that you're working on a long piece of work - a dissertation for a Masters, say. It's going to take you about 6 months to finish this monster and during that time, you've also got the rest of your life to get on with - family, friends, work, whatever. Now, every day of that 6 months, you bump into the same group of people at your bus stop on the way to work/university. They only ever ask you one question, and it's always the same question: how's the dissertation going? Don't you think you'd feel like changing your bus route after about day 5?

Yvonne

As a rarely-ever-nagged writer:

While I do keep in mind that some people have nagged me about one thing or another and think about it when I'm in my-writing-is-a-crap mood, I have never felt the need to hide myself from the readers. Of course, if anyone had such a need with the nagging I'm getting, they should consider seeing a shrink If I was nagged more mercilessly (this CAN'T be proper English!!), I don't know. But I think I would be able to handle it.
Truth is, that, as I said, I take it into consideration, but I'm kinda like "You'd like to read this? That's wonderful! Hope you won't mind waiting until I find the time/inspiration I write it!"
I only have the need to write regardless of time and/or inspiration when I'm posting a story in parts, but then it comes from inside me, not from the nagging I get.

As a reader:

I nag. I admit it. Not for sequels (unless a story is in desperate need of one... or so I think) but when it's an incomplete story, or an idea the writer has given up on.
Two reasons I'm doing it for:
a) I think the writer will appreciate it.
b) I want L&C fanfic to survive through the centuries (you can call me a paranoid here).
I make sure not to nag THAT much. I usually follow the others who have nagged already, and try not to put the writer under too much pressure.

Hope I made sense.
See ya,
AnnaBtG.

That about sums it up for me. I was always incredibly flattered when people would add a gentle nag with a feedback post or email, or even email me or post on the mbs out of the blue to nag a bit. And even though at this point I have no plans to write another LnC story, I always am flattered and pleased when people ask if I might change my mind and write something again.

But I can remember at least one time leaving IRC in tears because no matter how many times I asked people to stop nagging, they wouldn't stop. I tried to change the subject to no avail. I tried telling them that I was not physically capable of posting the next section because I didn't have the finished version (my co-author had it). I tried flat-out saying, "This is upsetting me. Please stop." Nothing helped. I was bombarded with demands to post immediately and repeatedly kicked out of the room. This went on for nearly forty minutes until finally I left the channel and didn't come back until after it had been posted. I know that no one meant for it to upset me and that they thought it was flattering and funny (several people who were involved later apologized, though one person told me to "get over it"). It was all supposed to be good fun, but people got carried away and I wound up very hurt.

So I think in general it is best to keep in mind that while most authors love to know that people want to read their stories and are eagerly awaiting another installment or a new story, they sometimes are not ready to post for whatever reason (RL time constraints, writer's block, etc) and incessant nagging is unlikely to change that. And if it goes overboard it may have the opposite effect. And even if it doesn't go so far as to block a writer further it can sap some of the joy of posting - after that incident I always avoided IRC whenever I had a story that was currently being posted.

Annie

I've been thinking about this thread while at work today, and I realise that it comes down to one thing: when we nag someone we know, it's easier to appreciate their reactions and know when to stop, whereas when we nag someone we just meet on irc now and then, we're not always as observant as we should be, and we can end up doing what Annie described and that upset her a lot, without being aware at all that it's upsetting to them. Annie, I can't remember if I was part of that crowd that night, but if I was, I'm really sorry for the way it made you feel. I'm sure the people who were there didn't mean to make you feel that way either.

Personally, I can't remember feeling really pressured by nagging, but then I realise that people have always been reasonable and no-one's ever got into the habit of jumping at me about it and making me feel trapped. CC, you talk about it being daunting if being nagged for a long awaited sequel - in fact, I've got to say that I would not even try writing it if it wasn't for the nagging I get - but then again, people don't remind me of it every single day, and I guess that's a very important factor. As it is now, when I get people nagging me for it in my inbox, I jump up and down and immediately feel the urge to open the file and write more. I don't feel pressured into writing as quickly as possible - if I feel that kind of pressure, I put it on myself; my readers don't. What they do is tell me that they haven't forgotten the first story, and that in itself is immensely flattering to me.

Then again, we all have different reactions to different things, depending on many things between our reaction to pressure, the context we live in, and mostly, I think, to the balance reached between the occasional push and the daily stalking. We can be under a lot of pressure in real life, at work or wherever, and in this case it gets harder to be put under pressure in the fandom as well. When it starts feeling like *real* pressure, it's not fun for you any more.

I tend to think that saying stop would work, but then obviously it didn't work for Annie. And then again one doesn't always feel comfortable saying stop when we all know that the person nagging doesn't mean any harm, even if it does you harm. That's why I think it's easier with people you know - then you might feel more comfortable telling them when they go too far.

I don't really have any solution to offer; as a writer, I don't want people to stop nagging me; as a reader, I don't want to stop nagging my favourite authors, yet I don't want to upset them, and unfortunately, I don't know all of them well enough to be completely sure of their reactions.

Kaethel

It depends. If I feel that nobody likes or responds to my story, then yes, I'd probably be sad or discouraged.

Many kind folks have made it clear to me that they like the story that i'm writing, but I don't write ... to pressure. I guess I write to the inspiration, and time of year, time of month, general state of real life - those can all halt that inspiration. Silence the muse.

And so nagging doesn't really spur me on.

But sometimes i've gotten lazy - and the muse may not be super necessary for a segment... or even - it may be that if i just buckle down, the muse will wake up.

I'm just a mass of contradiction I guess... sometimes I like and appreciate it, other times it stresses me out.

Some good motivational nagging is awesome. Many times I've felt my muse kick into gear after a good verbal kick in the butt.

Others may get sensitive about it and I don't have a lot of requests for writing except the faithful few <you know who you are and that I love you guys> but I say go for the nagging whenever you feel a writer is falling behind.

It's just words on a board and if it motivates your favorite writer it's a good tool. Otherwise the writer can just choose not to look/read the board if he/she is worried about getting nagged.

my $2.00 worth!!!

TEEEEEEEEEEEEEEJ

Good discussion, guys Nice to know I'm not completely around the bend on this.

Paul, I thought about it, and that had been my first plan, but I was too frazzled at the moment to come up with decent questions & replies. And I figured, the best part of the poll threads is the discussion on the thread anyway, so maybe we could do without the poll. If you'd like to do one, though, go for it! You've got a good set of questions & possible replies.

Thanks, CC, I think that just about sums it up I'd also include stories like Second Degree Burns and Meet Me in Kansas City 2 -- I know every time I mention Chris, someone, or several someones, is going to ask about MMiKC2. Now, it's nice that you guys even remember her name <g> considering she hasn't been active online for years, but, man... well, I'd be at least a little worried that people have built up their own image of how the story should be, and anything I could produce would fall far short and disappoint everyone. But again, as CC says, maybe that's just me -- and obviously others in this thread don't feel that way. Thank goodness <g>

For the record, I *do* appreciate people asking about things. If no one ever asked, I'd start to wonder if I'd been written off. It sometimes even works But then there's the times I get an email out of the blue asking if I ever wrote "President Kent 4" and I feel guilty telling them it's been gathering dust for 5-6 years with little chance of revival.

Like Kaethel said, it helps a lot when it's someone you know, because then you can just whack them with an imaginary 2x4 and they'll understand. And it's usually done in a very light-hearted way, which doesn't put the pressure on. And, too, a lot of it depends on how the individual author reacts, which you can't always predict.

So, you know... keep on asking me, every now and then. Just remember I have a life and kids and might even be a fun person to have around whether or not I ever write anything again

Inquiries and gentle reminders and teasing from friends are all great; let's just keep it below the level of obsessive stalking

PJ
who would like to say more but has to go to the grocery store before picking the kids up from school...

Faugh!! It wasn't *me* who temporarily "borrowed" CC's hard drive during TLGLL...I live in Minnesota...I can't afford to go tromping around in someone's bushes while trying to remove a hard drive from a CPU casing and losing the screwdriver in the hedges...

<gotta find those plane tickets!!!>

TEEEEEEEEJ

As I said on the ficlist... or tried to say, I was half asleep at the time, about the same as I am now... where was I? Oh yeah.

I love being nagged - in moderation. There have been times when I've been battling to put pen to paper (or finger to keyboard) and feeling like a complete failure, and being jumped on as soon as I went on IRC only made me feel worse. I have, at times, avoided IRC for that reason.

On the other hand, when I'm busy posting a story on the MBs, and people - especially those who are reading it and leaving FDK - ask when the next section is due to be posted or whether I've finished the story yet, that's a great feeling. And very motivational, too!

Mere

ok...

None of my stories were never nagged by anyone (perhaps because they were all MLTVs)

I've been nagged, though not recently. I believe in striking a balance between offering encouraging feedback to people, but not being excessively annoying.

First off, *awesome* thread, Pam!

I don't have time to respond to all that I'd like to, but I did want to throw this out there:

Gasp!! That means I'm not doing my job right, CC. Shame on me!

Just for the record, CC, I've never read anything from you that I thought was crap! I think your ideas are original, inspired and masterfully excuted! Please, please, please, keep writing!! I can't wait to see what you come up with next! (psst...I wouldn't mind if it had something to do with Lois and a certain cat or Superman drinking too much... )

I'm dashing off to work now, but I'll be back. I'm really enjoying this thread!

Sara (who hopes that Yvonne knows that she doesn't care *what* she writes, so long as she just keeps writing )

Okay, I debated whether or not I should post here because a lot of what I have to say has already been said. But I figure I'll just drop my two cents in and then run and hide <g>.

This hits the nail on the head for me, Pam! I love FoLCdom, and I love the people I've met here. But I've always had the sneaking suspicion that people only like me for what I can give them. (And I don't mean just FoLCs, this is a self-esteem issue that blankets all areas of my social life <g>)

When I was posting ID, waaaay back when, I don't know if I ever thought I'd actually finish it. Finishing stories wasn't really something I did <g>. It was just a one-off, throwaway nine page beginning that I posted to see how it was received. But the response was so much more overwhelmingly positive than I ever expected, and the readers were so encouraging and helpful, that I had to finish it. To date it's the longest thing I've ever managed to finish, and I owe that in great part to the faithful attention of my cheerleading squad and/or lynch mob <g>.

Now, at the time, I was just learning to use mIRC and talk to FoLCs in real time. Everytime I signed on someone would pounce on me. "Where's In Dreams?!" I'd become some sort of instant celebrity, which was amazing because I'm the sort of person who's too shy to make friends easily and doesn't do well in cliques. But for once here was a clique that valued me for how well I wrote, something I was relatively good at, as opposed to how I looked or dressed or how smart or dumb they were. The things I thought were cool-- a well written story, an elegant turn of phrase-- were the things they thought were cool. That was the most amazing thing I'd ever known.

So that was a great thing, and for a long time I felt really happy <g>.

But since then I've gone through some rough things. I've returned to school. I've spent some time writing other things. When you add it all up, it means I haven't posted anything for L&C in almost two years. And very quickly I started to notice a change in how I interacted in the channel. Now, obviously, people weren't going to jump on me everytime I came in channel, and I didn't expect that. But I started to hear "Kaylle, what are you working on lately? Why haven't you posted anything?" Which is all well and good until it starts to cross the line into "We're only interested in you when you're producing something." When I said I'd been too busy to write much, people would quickly tune me out. I had nothing more of value to contribute.

Now, I'm not at all implying that anyone out there has been deliberately perpetuating that attitude. In fact, it's most likely that I've invented it all. It's frightfully easy to misinterpret online conversations, where vocal inflections and facial expressions are all imaginary and subjective. So I don't want people to get defensive, or apologetic, because I honestly don't even remember who I felt slighted by <g>. I just thought I'd answer the question, because this has been something floating around in my head for a long time.

So, now that I've gone horribly off topic, what was I saying? Oh, yes. Nagging is good. Nagging reassures writers that they have people interested in their stories, and nagging keeps writers interested too. Nagging makes writers finish stories they might not otherwise bother with. But it's good to keep in mind that, contrary to Lois's belief <g>, a person is better than his/her next story.

(Wow, why did I write all that? <g>)
Kaylle

I'm sort of ambivalent. It's great to hear that people are enjoying your work, but that's just as easy to do by complimenting something already existing. I don't think of, "Wow!!! I really loved fic XYZ, I can't WAIT to see more things from you," specifically as a nag, and yet it accomplishes exactly what the nag is meant to do: Make the author aware that their work is cherished, and that more would always be appreciated. I don't really see you going wrong by complimenting something already finished -- it provides fuel to the inspirational fires, without making authors feel like they're cornered and pressured. I can see very easily where, "OMG WHERE IS THIS STORY!?" could grow old, and unwanted.

My personal feelings on the matter is that any feedback, good, bad, prodding, or dissuading, is a good thing, however. I rarely succumb to pressure of this kind, and sometimes I even thrive off of it. Even if the feedback generates bad feelings for me, I'm always happy to see I've moved somebody enough that they care to respond to what I've written. So to nag, or not to nag, I really don't mind either way when it comes to myself, because I have the ability to turn even the most anxious of feedbacks into something positive. The fact that somebody cares enough to harass me just tickles me.

I guess i should stop nagging about "One Strange Year" or "What's Love Got to do With It?" I'm really sorry...

Was quite surprised to find that so many writers are upset by nagging. Am now apologizing to those among that group whom I've nagged for fics ... honestly, I really meant it as an indicator that I was interested in your stories.

Although I've rarely been nagged, have to say it has been those occasions when I have that have mostly kickstarted my writing. As Nan said
cc malo

Well, I remember nagging you on multiple occasions, Carol... and then stopping because you insisted that you weren't writing anything at the moment.

I think what those who have had problems with nagging are getting at is that sometimes it can go too far. Honestly, I doubt very much that anyone objects to the 'what are you writing now?' or 'I can't wait to see another story from you' or 'hey, when are you going to finish XXXX?' nags. But it's the continual, never-let-up, almost bullying nags which people have had problems with.

Kaylle, I remember typing 'WHERE'S IN DREAMS????' to you every time you came on IRC. I'd hope that if you'd ever told me it made you feel pressured, I would have stopped (and I'm glad to hear that it actually encouraged you. ). Annie, I simply don't remember if I was there that night, but if I was, my sincere apologies. That's where people really do need to be more aware of others' sensitivities.

I guess I would see nagging, personally, as a huge compliment - it tells me that people want to read my work, that they're anxious to know when I'll be posting another story (or another part). But I've never been jumped on, on arriving on IRC, in the way some of my friends have now told me they have, so I haven't had the bad experiences which can turn nagging into something to dread.

However, I really would not like to see this thread taken as meaning that nobody should nag any writer, ever. I don't think that's what Pam intended, or what anyone who's posted about an unpleasant experience intended either. There's a balance. And we just need to be more aware that, when someone says 'please stop, this isn't fun', they mean it.

Carol, Sheila and anyone else who likes to nag: please carry on nagging! As Kaethel said, it's a great motivational experience for a writer. Personally, if I'm struggling with a story, as I sometimes do with longer stories, it really, really helps to know that people are anxious to read more. So nag with impunity... just with sensitivity too.


Wendy

(who says PS to Carol: got your email and will reply when I'm not up to my eyes in painting! )

Yes, that's precisely the point I was trying to get across. It's very flattering to have people ask after stories or sequels. As a writer, nothing makes me happier than having someone say, "Oh, I just loved such and such! Please most more soon! Please!"

The problem for me comes when people can't take no for an answer and continue to make demands and refuse to the let the subject drop after the person has explicitly asked them to do so.

For the record, I've never seen anything that would have upset me personally on the mbs. Occassionally I see posts nagging for more and am glad it's not me being pressured to put out when I'm not ready, but mb posts tend to be polite. Same with email. Barring the rare occassions of derranged fans making rude demands, personal emails tend to be the nicest and most inspiring nags.

The problem tends to be more on IRC. NOT because the people who frequent the channel are rude or insensitive or anything like that, I think that it's just a group mentality. One person starts nagging and everyone joins in and suddenly no one wants to let go. It seems fun and silly at first, it just gets out of control occassionally. Or, like Kaylle said, the problem is that people greet you not with "Hey! How have you been?" but with "Where's your next story?!" (Again, this is not a problem with the mb nagging, because people don't "greet" each other on the boards.)

Anyway, long story short, to all the naggers out there: please don't stop simply because a few of us have had bad experiences with extreme nagging. There is definitely a distinction between asking for more/being encouraging and harrassment/bullying. It would be sad if people stopped nagging altogether in order to eliminate a handful of bad experiences. Instead, my advice is just to be aware of the situation - if the writer seems upset, back off a bit. And remember that writers are people first, writers second and sometimes RL has to come first.

Annie